My fuse board in the pathfinder keeps blowing the 10Amp fuse for the bilge pump. I’ll put a new one in and it will work for between 10 seconds and 5-7 times of turning the bilge on (30 seconds each time), then blow again.
Anyone have suggestions? Replace bilge, move up to a 15 amp fuse,
clean bilge, etc?
Time to replace the pump. Rotor is locked or damaged causing it to draw high current.
It might be worth lifting up the bildge and seeing it you have any debris/mud…etc in there and clean it out. If there is anything clogging it up and keeping the motor from spinning freely it will draw excessive current and blow the fuse.
'07 198 DLX Carolina Skiff
FS90 Suzuki
What size and brand bilge pump is it?
Capt. Larry Teuton
Cracker Built Custom Boats
Small craft surveying and repair
DO NOT go up to a 15 Amp fuse. If you do, make sure your fire extinguisher is good to go.
That depends entirely on the pump. For instance, here is the specs on a Rule 2000. This is what I use on my skiff.
quote:
Specifications:Voltage 12 Vdc or 24 Vdc Amp Draw 8.4 amp Fuse Size 15 amp Height 6 inches (152 mm) Width 4 1/4 Inches (108 mm) Weight 2-15 lb (1.3 kg)
This is why we need to know the pump size:wink:
FWIW, a Rule pump has never been know to start a boat fire.
Capt. Larry Teuton
Cracker Built Custom Boats
Small craft surveying and repair
quote:
Originally posted by Cracker LarryThat depends entirely on the pump. For instance, here is the specs on a Rule 2000. This is what I use on my skiff.
quote:
Specifications:Voltage 12 Vdc or 24 Vdc Amp Draw 8.4 amp Fuse Size 15 amp Height 6 inches (152 mm) Width 4 1/4 Inches (108 mm) Weight 2-15 lb (1.3 kg)
This is why we need to know the pump size:wink:
FWIW, a Rule pump has never been know to start a boat fire.
Capt. Larry Teuton
Cracker Built Custom Boats
Small craft surveying and repair
Fuse size depends on wire size… yes, the wire should be matched to the needs of the user, but fuses are sized to protect the wire, not the user.
The pump wont start the fire, an undersized cable will. And it will do it fast.
So no - it dosen’t depend on the pump, it all depends on the wire size.
To the OP, my bilge pump was just doing the exact same thing. The pump shaft was corroded, it was pulling too much current and popping the fuse - the fuse pops to protect the cable from overheating.
Thanks for the detailed explanation Jughed. I should have given a little more specifics in my reply. I think you explained the danger very well.
To take it a step further, the wire size should be considered when you’re thinking of maybe going to a larger more powerful pump than the one that came as original equipment on your boat. Sounds like a good idea, but you may need to re-wire from your distribution panel. Just a thought.
I was assuming that the boat already has the correct size wire for the pump. If you are going to fuse it based on wire size, then you also have to consider wire length. Reference http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/amps-wire-gauge-d_730.html
Consider this. If your GPS is powered by 12ga wires, are you going to fuse it for the wire, or use the 3 amp fuse the manufacturer recommends?
quote:
The pump wont start the fire, an undersized cable will. And it will do it fast.So no - it dosen’t depend on the pump, it all depends on the wire size.
</font id=“quote”></blockquote id=“quote”>Again, I assumed the boat has adequate wire size for the pump in the first place, but I repeat that a Rule submersible pump has never been documented to cause a fire in a boat, not the pump and not in the wires. This is a fact. You can lock up that impeller for a week with power on it without damage. Other brands are different. Many marine surveyors, including myself and David Pascoe recommends not even fusing the bilge pump circuit. Reference http://www.yachtsurvey.com/bilge_pumps.htm
I don’t have any desire for an Internet argument, but I do this for a living:wink: Back to my original point, if the pump draws 10 amps, then a 10 amp fuse will not carry the load, so it does depend on the pump size.
Capt. Larry Teuton
Cracker Built Custom Boats
Small craft surveying and repair
Larry - I understand you build boats for a living and I am not starting an internet argument… In fact, there is no argument, we are talking about simple facts. If you oversize the fuse without checking the capacity of the cable first and foremost - you can burn your enitre boat. You cant simply recommend to size the fuse based on what the pump says without checking wire size first. Rule pump or not - if you pull 15amps thru a wire rated for 10 - you will burn the guys boat.
And yes, you can undersize the fuse to protect the equipment - but that isnt the intent of fuses or CB’s. Protection of the wire or the cable is the #1 role of a fuse.
PS - we don’t even know if the guy has a rule pump… all speculation that can burn his boat.
Thats my intent, not to argue with you - but to stop a potential problem for the OP. It would suck for his boat to fry over an incorrect fuse.
Did I mention that I have a degree in electronics engineering too? And I don’t just build boats, I’m also a Marine Surveyor.
It’s very simple, if the pump itself requires almost 10 amps to run, as mine does, then a 10 amp fuse will not hold it. I’m sure that Pathfinder used adequate size wire to start with, they build good boats. Why do you assume he has undersized cable? In a Pathfinder? Not.
We need to hear back from the OP with what size and brand pump he has. and if this is a new problem.
Capt. Larry Teuton
Cracker Built Custom Boats
Small craft surveying and repair
quote:
Originally posted by Cracker LarryDid I mention that I have a degree in electronics engineering too? And I don’t just build boats, I’m also a Marine Surveyor.
It’s very simple, if the pump itself requires almost 10 amps to run, as mine does, then a 10 amp fuse will not hold it. I’m sure that Pathfinder used adequate size wire to start with, they build good boats. Why do you assume he has undersized cable? In a Pathfinder? Not.
We need to hear back from the OP with what size and brand pump he has. and if this is a new problem.
Capt. Larry Teuton
Cracker Built Custom Boats
Small craft surveying and repair
did you get up on the wrong side of bed or something?
All we are saying is to check the cable size before upping the fuse. No assumptions being made. Just trying to help the guy not make a mistake… a big mistake.
And after a quick internet search - the oh so great Pathfinder uses Attwood Sahara pumps from time to time… My Attwood recommends a 7amp fuse.
Not that any of that matters - just like speculating about rule pumps.
quote:
did you get up on the wrong side of bed or something?
Maybe I did. Maybe I drank too much last night[:I] Maybe the full moon:question: If I came across bad, my apologies.
Capt. Larry Teuton
Cracker Built Custom Boats
Small craft surveying and repair
quote:
My Attwood recommends a 7amp fuse.
I’d chunk that tinker toy and put in a real pump, unless you have a jon boat 
Capt. Larry Teuton
Cracker Built Custom Boats
Small craft surveying and repair
Will research it this weekend. Due to location, it’s a little hard to see, but it looks red and white. Unsure size and brand.
Aw heck why not do away with the fuse and just straight wire it!
Larry don’t apologize… I read everything thing on my end just fine. If anyone woke up on the wrong side of the bed it was jughead… Some people just have to find things to argue/disagree about… Larry has been giving people on CF advice for a while now… He’s not gonna give someone bad info so they’ll “burn their boat down”
2007 Scout 221 150 Yamaha 4 stroke
quote:
Aw heck why not do away with the fuse and just straight wire it!
That is the way my boat is wired. The automatic pump is the only circuit on the boat that is not fused and cannot be shut off with the master switch. Many boats are lost due to sinking, mostly at the dock, from faulty pump wiring. None are lost to bilge pump wiring fires. The pump is the most important thing on the boat when you need it. You don’t want a little one, you don’t want a cheap one and you’ve got to know it will work when it has to.
A fused connection induces at least 5 possible points of failure. Each end of the fuse holder has a wire connection that must be tight and clean. Internally the fuse holder itself has a spring connection on each end with contact points and solder joints. Any of these can fail with a little time and salt water. Then the fuse itself can get tired and blow prematurely. If you aren’t on board, or you don’t have a spare fuse, then you are screwed. My opinion is to wire the main pump straight to the battery. I’d rather melt the wires than have the boat sink.
Capt. Larry Teuton
Cracker Built Custom Boats
Small craft surveying and repair
quote:
Originally posted by xxmadfirexxLarry don’t apologize… I read everything thing on my end just fine. If anyone woke up on the wrong side of the bed it was jughead… Some people just have to find things to argue/disagree about… Larry has been giving people on CF advice for a while now… He’s not gonna give someone bad info so they’ll “burn their boat down”
2007 Scout 221 150 Yamaha 4 stroke
Sorry - I didn’t wake up on the wrong side of bed/wasnt trying to start and argument with Larry, nor was I questioning his knowledge…
I am stating a simple fact - if you look at the pump & change the fuse - you better check the wire first as thats what the fuse is inteded to protect.
That has nothing to do with boat building, rule pumps, David Pascoe, marine surveying - thats fuse design 101.
If Pathfinder put in a 10AMP fuse - well we have to assume the wire is rated for 10AMP, then verify. Not the other way around.
And yes, making that mistake can burn your boat down.
Whatever. Have a great day
Capt. Larry Teuton
Cracker Built Custom Boats
Small craft surveying and repair