I still think popcorn works better. It doesn’t get soggy as fast.
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Two “bird chasing” buddies of mine were out there yesterday in their “glitter boat” and put a beating on the stripers casting A-rigs. They caught several multiples throughout the day. I know you can’t catch’em from the couch but you don’t always have a day like they had, especially given the crappy weather, when on the water. They crushed’em.
“You don’t always know where you stand till you know that you won’t run away.” ~Slipknot
My take on this chaos comes down to everyone trying to get near where there are actually still some fish. When you consider how many fish are supposedly stocked each year the population is depleted quickly and instead of having many schools to help spread the boats out there a very few. When you consider the fishing pressure increase in last 10 years we have had no adjustment to regulations. We all claim to love the sport and spend thousands of dollars to do it but most of us also have pounds of fish getting freezer burn in our freezers. There just are not as many fish in the lake anymore.
quote:
Originally posted by agentMy take on this chaos comes down to everyone trying to get near where there are actually still some fish. When you consider how many fish are supposedly stocked each year the population is depleted quickly and instead of having many schools to help spread the boats out there a very few. When you consider the fishing pressure increase in last 10 years we have had no adjustment to regulations. We all claim to love the sport and spend thousands of dollars to do it but most of us also have pounds of fish getting freezer burn in our freezers. There just are not as many fish in the lake anymore.
I agree there are increased amounts of anglers on the water …
I would also state that those same anglers are better at catching fish due to technological advancements (electronics, information exchange, equipment, etc.,) …
I disagree that the stocking efforts have not kept pace … DNR does two gill net samples every year and based upon those samples they determine how many to stock the following year … If memory recalls, Murray is stocked at the rate of either 12 or 14 Striped Bass per acre … so that’s between 600,000 and 700,000 stripers for Lake Murray … They stock between 1.3M and 1.5M every year …
I can tell you that I generally fish between 75-100 days per year … I consider myself to be an average fisherman, but let’s say I catch AND KEEP a limit every time I go out … that’s between 375 - 500 fish per year … (fat chance of that ever happening) … It would take 2,000 other people doing exactly the same thing every day to even put a dent in the population …
Now, all of that said, there was talk around this time last year about “where did all the big stripers go on Murray” … Lots of speculation about over-fishing and need for regulation reform …
its a put and take fishery so I think the regulation are fine, if continued stocking takes place. with the MSC donating to the striper cause im sure murray is being taken care of. My buddy saw DNR last Wednesday or Thursday where the rivers meet and said they were hauling in a bunch of fish. There is no shortage of fish.
quote:
Originally posted by Lawcrusherquote:
Originally posted by agentMy take on this chaos comes down to everyone trying to get near where there are actually still some fish. When you consider how many fish are supposedly stocked each year the population is depleted quickly and instead of having many schools to help spread the boats out there a very few. When you consider the fishing pressure increase in last 10 years we have had no adjustment to regulations. We all claim to love the sport and spend thousands of dollars to do it but most of us also have pounds of fish getting freezer burn in our freezers. There just are not as many fish in the lake anymore.
I agree there are increased amounts of anglers on the water …
I would also state that those same anglers are better at catching fish due to technological advancements (electronics, information exchange, equipment, etc.,) …
I disagree that the stocking efforts have not kept pace … DNR does two gill net samples every year and based upon those samples they determine how many to stock the following year … If memory recalls, Murray is stocked at the rate of either 12 or 14 Striped Bass per acre … so that’s between 600,000 and 700,000 stripers for Lake Murray … They stock between 1.3M and 1.5M every year …
I can tell you that I generally fish between 75-100 days per year … I consider myself to be an average fisherman, but let’s say I catch AND KEEP a limit every time I go out … that’s between 375 - 500 fish per year … (fat chance of that ever happening) … It would take 2,000 other people doing exactly the same thing every day to even put a dent in the population …
Now, all of that said, th
quote:
Originally posted by agentMy take on this chaos comes down to everyone trying to get near where there are actually still some fish. When you consider how many fish are supposedly stocked each year the population is depleted quickly and instead of having many schools to help spread the boats out there a very few. When you consider the fishing pressure increase in last 10 years we have had no adjustment to regulations. We all claim to love the sport and spend thousands of dollars to do it but most of us also have pounds of fish getting freezer burn in our freezers. There just are not as many fish in the lake anymore.
This is quite the silly, misinformed statement of the year…Murray is extremely healthy. The “chaos” is mostly “opportunistic” (this was discussed earlier) fisherman who arent there to target any certain fish. Just a bent rod and a tight line. More power to them. I had my yearly dealings with them but now its back to home field advantage and style of fishing that better suits me…
If you were only to receive or listen to reports from “opportunistic” fisherman you would swear Murray is headed down the tubes. I assure you its not. I kinda miss sharing every tidbit of every trip with the public but i enjoy catching (and releasing) the ghosts of Murray 
I am sure loon will be around shortly with some smart commit directed towards me… 
I have seen the fish on the graphs lately…there will be alot of big fish caught this winter and spring!!!
“All fisherman lie. And if they say otherwise, then they’re lying”
21’ Hewes Craft Custom
140 Suzuki
USCG Licensed Captain
Sea~N~Stripes Guide Service
This is a problem with people, and has nothing to do with fish numbers. The Chesapeake Bay and DE Bay are both a lot bigger than these lakes, and it’s a big problem in both. Of course everyone blames someone else.
It’s a problem with both rec & charter anglers, and some of them make it their standard practice.
I’ve seen it when fish were plentiful and could be caught fairly easily by those who looked for the fish, but still there’s those who follow, either the birds or other anglers. Less fish only makes it worse, but is not the root of the problem.
Many guys I know have devised all kinds of practices to keep others from seeing them bring a fish up, because that too will bring these chasers!
I think it was last year I had read a couple of them ended up in court because one got too close to another, and the first boat started casting sinkers at the second boat & someone got hurt.
Ridiculous for people to act that way! Unfortunately it’s happening in everyday life on our roadways with road rage, in politics, religion, heck, look at how people act buying for Christmas on Black Fridays! No respect, no concerns for others and certainly no morals!
I respectfully disagree. The math is only accurate in a perfect world. What you need to calculate in the mix is the poaching that takes place and the years we have summer fish kills. Bangstick, just imagine if there was a 2 fish limit and maybe a 23" keeper. I believe we would have a trophy fishery vs. a mediocre fishery. When was the last time you were approached by DNR to check your catch? In my 15 years NEVER. Ever hear of bilge area fish? That’s when people hide extra fish in bilge area just in case DNR were to miraculously check their catch. Also, ever hear of two trip days? That’s when a boat goes out and catches limit in morning and then back out in afternoon to catch another limit. Those numbers all add up over time. Call it emotion but I’m interested in a trophy fishery not just mediocre.
quote:
Originally posted by agentI respectfully disagree. The math is only accurate in a perfect world. What you need to calculate in the mix is the poaching that takes place and the years we have summer fish kills. Bangstick, just imagine if there was a 2 fish limit and maybe a 23" keeper. I believe we would have a trophy fishery vs. a mediocre fishery. When was the last time you were approached by DNR to check your catch? In my 15 years NEVER. Ever hear of bilge area fish? That’s when people hide extra fish in bilge area just in case DNR were to miraculously check their catch. Also, ever hear of two trip days? That’s when a boat goes out and catches limit in morning and then back out in afternoon to catch another limit. Those numbers all add up over time. Call it emotion but I’m interested in a trophy fishery not just mediocre.
Let’s not over-sensationalize things simply for the sake of defending an unfounded argument. If poachers were as rampant as your example illustrates and had the impacts you suggest, no one be allowed to fish Lake Murray, let alone keep fish. I assure you, when the DNR makes their re-stocking calculations, they account for all sorts of “loss” as it pertains to a fish’s population. They aren’t using the WAG methodology and they’re not throwing darts at random numbers on a wall.
As far as you hopes of Lake Murray being a “trophy” fishery, that’s not in the cards. As stated earlier, Murray is a put and take fishery, not a “trophy” fishery. I have no doubt others could comment much more intelligently than I can on this topic but to my knowledge, there are no plans on making Lake Murray and “trophy” striper fishery. There are “trophy” sized stripers in the lake but the lake is managed for quantity, not quality.
"You don’t always know where you stand till you know tha
I don’t see trophy or quantity compared to years ago. All I’m saying is wouldn’t it be special if we managed it to achieve both quantity and trophy? This would probably help the bird chaser chaos.
The winter and spring of 2016 is as close to a “murray trophy lake” anyone has seen since the 80s. And it was pretty far from any caliber of a trophy lake…it takes about 4-5yrs AFTER a big kill for murray to start throwing out teens almost every trip…its been 2yrs since our last kill and reports are already showing that same trend with small double digit sized fish showing up more frequently.
I know people who have put 10, 15, even 30yrs on this lake and havent caught a fish over 20#. They swear they are not there. But what the urban dictionary
definition of insanity? (Doing the same thing over and over expecting different results)…
The big fish are there…in the last 3 yrs murray has had higher weight totals than any other lake on the big tx trails…heck murray even out weighed 2 TN lake tournaments in the last 2 yrs…
Murray will never be a trophy fishery but the fish are present to make you think you fishing one…if you want to fish a “trophy” lake go to Russell…but even that lake doesnt produce like it used to, but fish in the teens are very common.
Back to the perfect math…so your saying lawcrushers scenario would have to take place AND on top of that poachers would still have to be present filling bilges daily???
Great time for an MSC plug…come out to the meeting tomorrow at flight deck and ask DNR (who will be there giving the state of the lake presentation) how they think the fishery is doing…they dont just guess, you will see real numbers from gill net surveys and stocking numbers…
“All fisherman lie. And if they say otherwise, then they’re lying”
21’ Hewes Craft Custom
140 Suzuki
USCG Licensed Captain
Sea~N~Stripes Guide Service
Sorry i am just feeling full of myself today…gotta add. Bird chasers arent a problem because all of the fish are stacked up, bird chasers are a issue because of the method and location…AND SOCIAL MEDIA…
there is almost a direct correlation between the amount of info shared on SM and the amount of people showing up to chase birds or just to fish period…shoot when people ask me where to fish i send them all to the same location. Its not a goose chase…i know fish are there but so is everyone else.
I am just rambling on now looking and sounding like a conceited b-hole… and i do come off that way sometimes but i really am not as bad as i sound…lol…
I better hang it up for the night…giving Loon too much ammo to fire back at me
“All fisherman lie. And if they say otherwise, then they’re lying”
21’ Hewes Craft Custom
140 Suzuki
USCG Licensed Captain
Sea~N~Stripes Guide Service
It pains me that we are all willing to accept mediocrity. Murraymaker I know you as one of the best fisherman on the lake. What about the average Joe? Did you ever think of the guy who fishes a dozen times of year with his Grandson/Granddaughter? If we got to a point where there were twice as many fish in the lake he would have a much better chance of a great experience!! Lets face it, most of us Striper fishing fanatics would be just as gratified catching a nice fish just for the sport of it. Sorry this got away from the subject but more areas with fish help solve the bird chaser chaos too.
quote:
Originally posted by agentI respectfully disagree. The math is only accurate in a perfect world. What you need to calculate in the mix is the poaching that takes place and the years we have summer fish kills. Bangstick, just imagine if there was a 2 fish limit and maybe a 23" keeper. I believe we would have a trophy fishery vs. a mediocre fishery. When was the last time you were approached by DNR to check your catch? In my 15 years NEVER. Ever hear of bilge area fish? That’s when people hide extra fish in bilge area just in case DNR were to miraculously check their catch. Also, ever hear of two trip days? That’s when a boat goes out and catches limit in morning and then back out in afternoon to catch another limit. Those numbers all add up over time. Call it emotion but I’m interested in a trophy fishery not just mediocre.
I get checked regularly. Maybe it’s the law of averages, the more times I’m on the lake, the more chances I have of getting checked and DNR has been thorough with their checks. I rarely keep fish, though, because I do have the opportunity to fish as much as I want. Anyway, the argument about poaching taking it’s toll on our fishery just doesn’t hold water with me, pun intended. Do you realize just how many poachers that it would take to have a negative effect on our fishery?? As much as I like to catch trophy fish, our fishery is a put and take fishery, not a trophy fishery, so if you want trophy fish, I’d suggest Russell, one of the Tennessee lakes, or maybe Clark’s Hill.
-The size of a fish is directly proportional to the time between when it’s lost and the story is told. - Me
-What’s the best eating fish, you ask? I’ve found that for a lot people, its the ones that they happen to be able to catch, clean, and cook. - My Dad (1/13/37 - 9/27/16 I love you Pops)
-Until you
I am by far Not even close to being as good as many many of the guys who fish this Lake… I target big fish and get lucky…not Many people get to see how many times I fail they just get to see the pictures of when I succeed…
We did get a little off subject lol but look at it this way if they were to change the limits and by theoretically There would be more fish in the Lake the stocking numbers would go down which in turn would produce the same amount of fish in the Lake as there is now… It boils down to DNR scientifically watching over the Lake and knowing what they have to do to keep a sustainable population for a healthy Lake
“All fisherman lie. And if they say otherwise, then they’re lying”
21’ Hewes Craft Custom
140 Suzuki
USCG Licensed Captain
Sea~N~Stripes Guide Service
quote:
Originally posted by agentIt pains me that we are all willing to accept mediocrity. Murraymaker I know you as one of the best fisherman on the lake. What about the average Joe? Did you ever think of the guy who fishes a dozen times of year with his Grandson/Granddaughter?</font id=“size4”></font id=“red”> If we got to a point where there were twice as many fish in the lake he would have a much better chance of a great experience!! Lets face it, most of us Striper fishing fanatics would be just as gratified catching a nice fish just for the sport of it. Sorry this got away from the subject but more areas with fish help solve the bird chaser chaos too.
I have grands and I can assure you that all they care about is a tug on the line, NOT a trophy fish.
-The size of a fish is directly proportional to the time between when it’s lost and the story is told. - Me
-What’s the best eating fish, you ask? I’ve found that for a lot people, its the ones that they happen to be able to catch, clean, and cook. - My Dad (1/13/37 - 9/27/16 I love you Pops)
-Until you have loved a dog, part of your soul remains unawakened. Anatole France (paraphrased)
-RIP my “Puppy Dog” 10/15/2004 - 1/14/2013. I’ll never forget him. What a special friend he was.
-Team Gonna Fish
When I used to bass fish I would frequently visit Ontario Canada Lakes where it was a different management philosophy.The fishing was phenomenal compared to our lakes. I understand put and take but how about we put but take just a little less to hopefully spread everyone out and try to achieve something special!!!
quote:
Originally posted by agentWhen I used to bass fish I would frequently visit Ontario Canada Lakes where it was a different management philosophy.The fishing was phenomenal compared to our lakes. I understand put and take but how about we put but take just a little less to hopefully spread everyone out and try to achieve something special!!!
As i mentioned above more fish in the lake wont spread people out (why?) Because of uncle Johnny and tommy caught fish over here and posted it on social media and lets not forget about ricky and bobby who saw them and told the world bout it as well…
There are tons of fish all over the lake but everyone chooses to be in one place…5 years ago i fished my 1st MSC tx…it was January, didnt have a clue what i was doing. Carried my 4 fish creel (caught a ton of keepers that day) to the scales that i caught in front of water treatment plant in jakes. Did the same for feb that yr. There have been winters i never left ballentine. This was all before social media and the sharing of information publicly. I didnt know “you gotta go up lake to the rivers to catch fish”
Not to say that it will never happen, but the odds of catching a big fish are stacked against you fishing where someone tells you to fish or where you have heard they are catching fish or even around others fishing…big fish are generally loners and you should be too if u wanna catch a “trophy”…
“All fisherman lie. And if they say otherwise, then they’re lying”
21’ Hewes Craft Custom
140 Suzuki
USCG Licensed Captain
Sea~N~Stripes Guide Service
I still hold true to the fact that more pressure deserves an adjustment in regulations. Nothing stays the same. Do we really believe that 10 years from now when there are twice as many fishing boats out there our current regulations will still accomplish what intended?