Commercial snapper anglers sought to assist in study
Staff report
Wednesday, February 15, 2012
Federal researchers are looking for a commercial fisherman to catch ear bones. Red snapper ear bones and heads, to be precise.
The National Marine Fisheries Service office in Beaufort, N.C., is conducting a collaborative project in Georgia, South and North Carolina to survey snapper age distribution across the region. It’s part of a bigger effort to collect more information about a species that regulators have determined is overfished. Anglers dispute the regulators’ studies as a spotty, inaccurate sampling of a fishery that spans from North Carolina to the Florida Keys.
Ear bones are used to determine a snapper’s age, said Warren Mitchell, NMFS fisheries biologist.
The study seeks a commercial angler from each of the three states, “experienced snapper-grouper fishermen to deploy three gears targeting red snapper,” according to a NMFS news release. The gear will be hook-and-line, vertical and horizontal longline. Anglers must carry an observer.
Interested persons would submit competitive bids as federal contractors. Contact warren.mitchell@noaa.gov or 252-728-8755.
quote:The study seeks a commercial angler from each of the three states,
Only one from each state? That isn’t a reasonable sample. Anyway, most of the commercial snapper and grouper fisherman I know of have had to sell their boats and get a real job flipping hamburgers or something.
quote:Why don't the douchebags just open the season back up for a month or two...duh.
Or a year. That would make too much sense. Recreational fishermen could easily take ear bone samples and file catch and measurement reports. We could even bring them back all the heads to remove the otolith bones themselves That would give them a good sample. One fisherman per state won’t mean anything. They aren’t interested in what is really going on though, they are just making another political show.
This is a good thing. The commercial guys in Florida have been asking to get a longline survey for a few years now, but bottom longlines were outlawed several years back. It seems like they may finally be able to get their wish.
These guys claim that if they are allowed to set these experimental longlines in an area known as the “steeples” (an old commercial spot from the 70’s) that they could easily show many fish > 15 years old. I think that this is 240’+ of water plus and supposedly where the big grandaddy snapper hang out… Evidently, this place is full of current and is impractical for them to fish on hook and line (i.e. they can stay closer to shore and catch just as much). They say that the commercial guys pretty much abandoned this area once longlining was outlawed.
Evidently most of the older data that says that there should be a lot of older fish came from these longliners in the 60’s-70’s. So, many of the current commercial guys believe that this is the missing link of data. They outlawed bottom longlines = no more older fish showing up in the survey = they think we are overfished… So, the plan is to prove that survey bias is the reason why the government has screwed the pooch on this one…
So, we should wish them luck on this one! If they do show that they can find a bunch of > 15 year old fish with the longline gear, then it could be a game changer.
This is a good thing. The commercial guys in Florida have been asking to get a longline survey for a few years now, but bottom longlines were outlawed several years back. It seems like they may finally be able to get their wish.
These guys claim that if they are allowed to set these experimental longlines in an area known as the “steeples” (an old commercial spot from the 70’s) that they could easily show many fish > 15 years old. I think that this is 240’+ of water plus and supposedly where the big grandaddy snapper hang out… Evidently, this place is full of current and is impractical for them to fish on hook and line (i.e. they can stay closer to shore and catch just as much). They say that the commercial guys pretty much abandoned this area once longlining was outlawed.
Evidently most of the older data that says that there should be a lot of older fish came from these longliners in the 60’s-70’s. So, many of the current commercial guys believe that this is the missing link of data. They outlawed bottom longlines = no more older fish showing up in the survey = they think we are overfished… So, the plan is to prove that survey bias is the reason why the government has screwed the pooch on this one…
So, we should wish them luck on this one! If they do show that they can find a bunch of > 15 year old fish with the longline gear, then it could be a game changer.
Only problem is it does not appear that sampling will be done in Florida, they are sampling GA, SC and NC only
They already did a longline sample in Florida. State of Florida and commercial guys went and fished at the wrong time of year with the wrong type of gear and blew the assumptions out of the water with exactly what the fishermen had been saying was out in the protected current and depths.
LOADS of big, old snapper.
NMFS threw the study out… so what makes you think they’ll accept anything that comes from the above proposal?
It’s all lip service and an attempt to look like they’re acting in good faith. At the same time, we’ve got to take them up on it.
Every time I have found any sort of isolated structure out in 180-350ft, there have snapper on it bigger than I’ve ever personally caught before. People don’t understand how the gulf stream and high relief structure give bottom fish natural protection unless you can bottom longline. As Skinnee said, that type of fishing has been outlawed for a while, and the fish have benefited greatly. If you try to vertical hook and line these fish when current isn’t hauling butt, you get about 3 days a month when it can be done, and there’s nothing to promise you the wind isn’t blowing too hard on those days.
One of the falacies of the assessments on red snapper is that the entire range of red snapper even out to 300ft has been fished equally hard, while the reality is that headboats never went out that far, especially before Loran C, and especially not now with fuel prices and regulations in place since the early '90’s.
Just another idiotic assumption like a flat selectivity curve and 40-90 percent release mortaility that gives us this overregulation that they’ve now sandbagged to the sky.
I am no expert or claim to have all the answers, just an opinion. I cant see why the states don’t try to employ a volunteer force to monitor boat ramps and take surveys from fishermen returning from their outings? When I lived in Wisconsin, I cant tell you how many times I was approached by a college student with a survey at a boat ramp. Cost to the state $0.00. This could provide the state with information on how many anglers hit the waters, what was caught and released, how many inshore and offshore anglers there are hitting the waters and how often they are going out. I’m sure there are other questions that could be asked. The only problem I would see with this approach is it would be closer data then the swag they are using now and bad fishing days could back fire on us and tougher regulations could be levied upon us.
A wise man once said “Do as I say not as I do” Good advice when I tell you that.
That would give them a good sample. One fisherman per state won’t mean anything. They aren’t interested in what is really going on though, they are just making another political show.