Oh great one of natural climate swings, please tell me what co2 does?
another of my favorites…
" the fact that we are warming at levels unseen in human history!"
I’m waiting on Palmer to tell us what it does.
“Those who have the ability to make a difference have the responsibility to do so.” Thomas Jefferson
Ahhh…
Apologies…
I’ve left out a word.
Where I have previously written, “No one claims that adding CO2 to the mix should increase that effect”, it should have read “No one claims that adding CO2 to the mix should not increase that effect.”
Where I was being a smart-a55, I should have proof read my posts more carefully.
Apologies humbly offered to those on the alarmist side of the debate.
Apologies out of the way.
Alarmist claims are based on model predictions.
Models disagree with actual measured data and are, thus, invalidated.
Absent other substantiation for the alarmism, the alarmist have no case.
17’ Henry O Hornet
26’ Palmer Scott
quote:
Originally posted by PalmerScottAhhh…
Apologies…
I’ve left out a word.Where I have previously written, “No one claims that adding CO2 to the mix should increase that effect”, it should have read “No one claims that adding CO2 to the mix should not increase that effect.”
Where I was being a smart-a55, I should have proof read my posts more carefully.
Apologies humbly offered to those on the alarmist side of the debate.Apologies out of the way.
Alarmist claims are based on model predictions.
Models disagree with actual measured data and are, thus, invalidated.
Absent other substantiation for the alarmism, the alarmist have no case.
17’ Henry O Hornet
26’ Palmer Scott
Why won’t you tell everyone what co2 does in the atmosphere?
“Those who have the ability to make a difference have the responsibility to do so.” Thomas Jefferson
I would really like to know what co2 does to the atmosphere? oh great one tell me
Here’s what C02 does:
Carbon Dioxide Levels Are a Blessing, Not a Problem
For centuries, bloodletting was an accepted medical procedure administered by physicians to treat patients for most illnesses. In today’s world, we find it almost inconceivable that such a practice was condoned by entire populations.
Similarly, the claim that increased carbon dioxide (CO2) in the atmosphere is causing “global warming” has been accepted as “fact” in many countries worldwide. This belief has no more scientific foundation than the bloodletting of past generations.
Atmospheric carbon dioxide may be gradually rising, but there is no compelling evidence that such a modest rise in CO2, which still comprises significantly less than 1 percent of the Earth’s atmosphere, will have any substantial negative effect on the Earth’s environment.
Scientists Ignored
Activists have successfully pressured governments to declare CO2 a pollutant and to take drastic measures to reduce the amount entering the atmosphere. By contrast, little publicity is given to the large number of qualified scientists who strongly contest the claims of the advocacy groups. These scientists contend that if CO2 plays any part in global warming, it is so insignificant that it can barely be measured, let alone be the major cause.
One rationale given for claims that Earth’s recent, moderate warming is being caused by increases in atmospheric CO2 is the high surface temperature of Venus, which stands at approximately 472? C. Venus is an Earth-size planet that has a predominantly CO2 atmosphere.
If the Earth?s Atmosphere Were a Football Stadium
Atmospheric Gas Percent in Atmosphere People in the Stadium
Nitrogen (N2) 78% 7,800
Oxygen (O2) 21% 2,100
Argon (A) 1% 100
Carbon Dioxide (CO2) 0.038% 4
However, a comparison between Venus and the Earth’s recent moderate increase in atmospheric CO2 is misleading, because there is 25,000 times as much CO2 in Venus’s atmosphere as there is in the atmosphere of Earth.
CO2 Rare i
With that out of the way, let’s continue the discussion.
…Politicians aren’t the “Oldest Profession”, but the results are still the same!!!
quote:
Originally posted by Mixed NutzHere’s what C02 does:
Carbon Dioxide Levels Are a Blessing, Not a Problem
For centuries, bloodletting was an accepted medical procedure administered by physicians to treat patients for most illnesses. In today’s world, we find it almost inconceivable that such a practice was condoned by entire populations.
Similarly, the claim that increased carbon dioxide (CO2) in the atmosphere is causing “global warming” has been accepted as “fact” in many countries worldwide. This belief has no more scientific foundation than the bloodletting of past generations.
Atmospheric carbon dioxide may be gradually rising, but there is no compelling evidence that such a modest rise in CO2, which still comprises significantly less than 1 percent of the Earth’s atmosphere, will have any substantial negative effect on the Earth’s environment.
Scientists Ignored
Activists have successfully pressured governments to declare CO2 a pollutant and to take drastic measures to reduce the amount entering the atmosphere. By contrast, little publicity is given to the large number of qualified scientists who strongly contest the claims of the advocacy groups. These scientists contend that if CO2 plays any part in global warming, it is so insignificant that it can barely be measured, let alone be the major cause.
One rationale given for claims that Earth’s recent, moderate warming is being caused by increases in atmospheric CO2 is the high surface temperature of Venus, which stands at approximately 472? C. Venus is an Earth-size planet that has a predominantly CO2 atmosphere.
If the Earth?s Atmosphere Were a Football Stadium
Atmospheric Gas Percent in Atmosphere People in the Stadium
Nitrogen (N2) 78% 7,800
Oxygen (O2) 21% 2,100
Argon (A) 1% 100
Carbon Dioxide (CO2) 0.038% 4However, a comparison between Venus and the Earth’s recent m
So, does anyone else find it ironic that we are talking about an ice age because of global warming causing the ice caps to melt, but in the graphic above, the LARGEST preceding heat waves were usually followed by the LESSER significant ice age? Hmmmm…
quote:
Originally posted by on a fishin missionquote:
Originally posted by Mixed NutzHere’s what C02 does:
Carbon Dioxide Levels Are a Blessing, Not a Problem
For centuries, bloodletting was an accepted medical procedure administered by physicians to treat patients for most illnesses. In today’s world, we find it almost inconceivable that such a practice was condoned by entire populations.
Similarly, the claim that increased carbon dioxide (CO2) in the atmosphere is causing “global warming” has been accepted as “fact” in many countries worldwide. This belief has no more scientific foundation than the bloodletting of past generations.
Atmospheric carbon dioxide may be gradually rising, but there is no compelling evidence that such a modest rise in CO2, which still comprises significantly less than 1 percent of the Earth’s atmosphere, will have any substantial negative effect on the Earth’s environment.
Scientists Ignored
Activists have successfully pressured governments to declare CO2 a pollutant and to take drastic measures to reduce the amount entering the atmosphere. By contrast, little publicity is given to the large number of qualified scientists who strongly contest the claims of the advocacy groups. These scientists contend that if CO2 plays any part in global warming, it is so insignificant that it can barely be measured, let alone be the major cause.
One rationale given for claims that Earth’s recent, moderate warming is being caused by increases in atmospheric CO2 is the high surface temperature of Venus, which stands at approximately 472? C. Venus is an Earth-size planet that has a predominantly CO2 atmosphere.
If the Earth?s Atmosphere Were a Football Stadium
Atmospheric Gas Percent in Atmosphere People in the
quote:
Originally posted by on a fishin missionActually, that article does not tell you what co2 does. It avoids doing so, as Palmer has dine for the last 2 weeks.
It’s also from the heartland institute which would be the same thing as me posting an article by Greenpeace and not expecting it to be biased.
OK - I made an editing mistake and left out a word. So, technically, I did avoid the question for a while. But, said mistake now fixed, I have addressed the question directly. I’ll repeat.
Where the ‘effect’ is the Greenhouse effect, I wrote:
quote:
PalmerScott Where I have previously written, "No one claims that adding CO2 to the mix should increase that effect", it should have read "No one claims that adding CO2 to the mix should not increase that effect."
Where I’ve said it explicitly, I’ll say it again, differently.
The increase in conentration of a greenhouse gas will generally cause an increase in the greenhouse effect.
OFM - are you satisfied?
The question is not a matter of the basic broad-brush aspects of the science. It never has been. The question has to do with how much warming can you blame on anthropogenic sources.
Back to your assertion, that we’re pouring gas on the fire.
In order to substantiate that you have to:
- Establish how much we’ve warmed.
- How much of that is due to natural variability.
- By that, show how much is due to human contributions.
The approach to doing those things has been to create highly complex climate models and make predictions with them.
The FACT that actual measured temperatures at the surface and at various altitudes i
As a footnote to above, Climate Change models (not one) have even come close to a precast of the last few decades of weather conditions, where we know EXACTLY what the weather was, so how reliable can they be at forecasting our future climate?
Still waiting on you to debunk the facts in the Heartland article.
…Politicians aren’t the “Oldest Profession”, but the results are still the same!!!
quote:
Originally posted by Mixed NutzHere’s what C02 does:
Carbon Dioxide Levels Are a Blessing, Not a Problem
For centuries, bloodletting was an accepted medical procedure administered by physicians to treat patients for most illnesses. In today’s world, we find it almost inconceivable that such a practice was condoned by entire populations.
Similarly, the claim that increased carbon dioxide (CO2) in the atmosphere is causing “global warming” has been accepted as “fact” in many countries worldwide. This belief has no more scientific foundation than the bloodletting of past generations.
Atmospheric carbon dioxide may be gradually rising, but there is no compelling evidence that such a modest rise in CO2, which still comprises significantly less than 1 percent of the Earth’s atmosphere, will have any substantial negative effect on the Earth’s environment.
Scientists Ignored
Activists have successfully pressured governments to declare CO2 a pollutant and to take drastic measures to reduce the amount entering the atmosphere. By contrast, little publicity is given to the large number of qualified scientists who strongly contest the claims of the advocacy groups. These scientists contend that if CO2 plays any part in global warming, it is so insignificant that it can barely be measured, let alone be the major cause.
One rationale given for claims that Earth’s recent, moderate warming is being caused by increases in atmospheric CO2 is the high surface temperature of Venus, which stands at approximately 472? C. Venus is an Earth-size planet that has a predominantly CO2 atmosphere.
If the Earth?s Atmosphere Were a Football Stadium
Atmospheric Gas Percent in Atmosphere People in the Stadium
Nitrogen (N2) 78% 7,800
Oxygen (O2) 21% 2,100
Argon (A) 1% 100
Carbon Dioxide (CO2) 0.038% 4However, a comparison between Venus and the Earth’s recent m
Palmer, why will you not tell everyone what co2 does. Your previous statements do nothing but dodge the question. What does co2 do in the atmosphere? It’s a very simple question
quote:
Originally posted by on a fishin missionPalmer, why will you not tell everyone what co2 does. Your previous statements do nothing but dodge the question. What does co2 do in the atmosphere? It’s a very simple question
Can I play OFM?
C02 helps keep the warmth from the Sun in our atmosphere instead of radiating back into space. Right? Been going on Billions of years in cycles in our Worlds history. Right?
Man is currently injecting an estimated 8 gigatons (4% of the worlds total) Nature injects 210 gigatons a year which is down from a few century’s ago. Also man’s C02 rate is down due to re-forestation efforts helping absorb c02.
Here’s were you’ll disagree with me. I think man needs to increase c02 emissions to help keep our World warm. Our World does not have the Volcanic activity and is slowly cooling. There is the real problem. We are coming out of this last Ice age too slow. My Great great great grands won’t get to enjoy their Peach orchard in Canada if we don’t do something to help.
A rare fact for you… The massive buffalo herds that roamed our Great Country before the White man came gave off an estimated 5 gigatons of c02. That’s more than man does now. Also Mt. St. Helena released more Greenhouse gases in a single eruption than all of man in the industrial revolution.
Global warming because of man’s intervention is a scam. Open yours eyes. Focus on Man’s immorality, lack of work ethic, and growing dependence on free ice cream.
Still waiting! Don’t dodge, debunk the Heartland article if you will?
…Politicians aren’t the “Oldest Profession”, but the results are still the same!!!
quote:That is a lot of buffalo fart...
Originally posted by Fred67A rare fact for you… The massive buffalo herds that roamed our Great Country before the White man came gave off an estimated 5 gigatons of c02.
quote:
OFM Palmer, why will you not tell everyone what co2 does. Your previous statements do nothing but dodge the question. What does co2 do in the atmosphere? It's a very simple question
Floats?
Hangs out with its friend and gets high on ozone?
I’m not sure what you’re driving at. I’ve repeatedly stated that: No one claims that adding CO2 to the mix should not increase that effect, where the effect is the greenhouse effect. Adding greenhouse gas should increase the greenhouse effect.
Again, the point of contention is not in the broad basics of the science. The assertion that a relatively minor increase to the greenhouse gas mix of a weak greenhouse gas is going to make the Earth spin off of its axis are solely based on the understanding of our climate that is built into the GCMs. The GCMs are steadily showing themselves to be useless. The experts who build and run the models and who manage the in-situ data sets have admitted as much. Ergo, the assertion has no basis.
Yes, we are pouring gasoline on a fire. But, we are not pouring 100 gallons of gas on a candle and torching our house. We’re pouring a small amount of gasoline on a forest fire. The effect will be real, but, quite small and insignificant.
quote:
A rare fact for you… The massive buffalo herds that roamed our Great Country before the White man came gave off an estimated 5 gigatons of c02. That’s more than man does now. Also Mt. St. Helena released more Greenhouse gases in a single eruption than all of man in the industrial revolution.
And, that’s just the CO2 which is a minor and weak greenhouse gas. Compared to the methane (a much stronger greenhouse gas) that was produced by those herds, the CO2 was nothing.
17’ Henry O Hornet
26’ Palmer Scott
quote:
Originally posted by Fred67quote:
Originally posted by on a fishin missionPalmer, why will you not tell everyone what co2 does. Your previous statements do nothing but dodge the question. What does co2 do in the atmosphere? It’s a very simple question
Can I play OFM?
C02 helps keep the warmth from the Sun in our atmosphere instead of radiating back into space. Right? Been going on Billions of years in cycles in our Worlds history. Right?
Man is currently injecting an estimated 8 gigatons (4% of the worlds total) Nature injects 210 gigatons a year which is down from a few century’s ago. Also man’s C02 rate is down due to re-forestation efforts helping absorb c02.
Here’s were you’ll disagree with me. I think man needs to increase c02 emissions to help keep our World warm. Our World does not have the Volcanic activity and is slowly cooling. There is the real problem. We are coming out of this last Ice age too slow. My Great great great grands won’t get to enjoy their Peach orchard in Canada if we don’t do something to help.
A rare fact for you… The massive buffalo herds that roamed our Great Country before the White man came gave off an estimated 5 gigatons of c02. That’s more than man does now. Also Mt. St. Helena released more Greenhouse gases in a single eruption than all of man in the industrial revolution.
Global warming because of man’s intervention is a scam. Open yours eyes. Focus on Man’s immorality, lack of work ethic, and growing dependence on free ice cream.
There is some truth in there, but most is misinformed and I can explain.
Yes co2