Wait… I see what I did now… Let me fix the numbers… Lease still wins…
quote:So you negotiated the new car and didn't negotiate the lease?
Originally posted by GeronimoIf you buy a crappy car that depreciates quickly, and have lousy credit, then sure a lease might work out. But for me, buying a car with one of the highest resale values and having the highest credit rating, a lease was about as dumb a move as I could make.
Resale value makes ZERO difference (with respect to value). You are financing the depreciation. So if the depreciation is only $10, then you only finance $10.
It sounds to me like they squeezed you into buying because they knew they could make more of a profit that way. Like I said before, all they did was hide numbers from you. If you didn’t actually calculate them out, then you didn’t compare apples to apples.
What matters most is length of ownership…
ALL loans work this way… If you are a “short termer”, then you pay most interest up front and hardly knock into the principal. In the scenario of “buying”, you are financing a LOT more (more than 2x), so even if you get a better rate, you are paying mostly interest for the first 2-3 years.
One more thing I should add… With my last car, I first went to the GMC dealership on Hwy 17 to look at a Yukon XL for the wife (who hates the thought of driving a car for more than 3 years). They could not have been more shady and dishonest with the numbers. When I asked them what the “money factor” was, they told me that it didn’t matter. I told them to get lost and I went over to Rick Hendrick. If they don’t budge, you walk away. They aren’t the only game in town! Same vehicle (Suburban), with exact same starting sticker price (same options, etc). They were SUPER transparent with the numbers right up front. No trickery at all. We still negotiated, and I got the lease for about $200/mo less than what they wanted at GMC. I will NEVER go to the GMC dealership again.
quote:
Originally posted by skinneejquote:I used 6.6% for both of them. Also, you only got 2.9% with "great credit"??? You should be lower than that.
Originally posted by GeronimoAt the end of year 3:
Lease: Payments: $19980, Owe: $0, Equity: $0 => Cost to have = $19,980
Purchase: Payments: $35280, Owe: $21,992, Equity: $8008 ($30K - $21,992) => Cost to have = $27,272 (Payments - Equity)Your numbers are way off. Why would you factor 0% on the lease and 6.5% on the new purchase? I just purchased new at 3.5%
I just ran the numbers on our recent new purchase and taking their current lease offer into account. The 3 year lease would cost $22,000 out of pocket and the new purchase would cost $16,500 over 3 years.
If you buy a crappy car that depreciates quickly, and have lousy credit, then sure a lease might work out. But for me, buying a car with one of the highest resale values and having the highest credit rating, a lease was about as dumb a move as I could make.
“Wailord”
1979 17’ Montauk
90 JohnsonWilderness Ride 115
Would be today. That was months ago.
“Wailord”
1979 17’ Montauk
90 Johnson
Wilderness Ride 115
quote:
Originally posted by GeronimoIf you buy a crappy car that depreciates quickly, …, then sure a lease might work out. But for me, buying a car
It’s actually the opposite of that. In this scenario a lease may not be your best option (you would have to run numbers to find out). Again, you are financing the depreciation, so if your car depreciates a lot, then you are financing more in the lease.
Maybe that’s why they pushed you into buying a new car!!!
quote:
Originally posted by skinneejOne more thing I should add… With my last car, I first went to the GMC dealership on Hwy 17 to look at a Yukon XL for the wife (who hates the thought of driving a car for more than 3 years). They could not have been more shady and dishonest with the numbers. When I asked them what the “money factor” was, they told me that it didn’t matter. I told them to get lost and I went over to Rick Hendrick. If they don’t budge, you walk away. They aren’t the only game in town! Same vehicle (Suburban), with exact same starting sticker price (same options, etc). They were SUPER transparent with the numbers right up front. No trickery at all. We still negotiated, and I got the lease for about $200/mo less than what they wanted at GMC. I will NEVER go to the GMC dealership again.
If I had to buy a domestic car I would probably do a lease as well. Let the dealership take a bath on the 50% depreciation on those things.
“Wailord”
1979 17’ Montauk
90 Johnson
Wilderness Ride 115
quote:
Originally posted by skinneejquote:
Originally posted by GeronimoIf you buy a crappy car that depreciates quickly, …, then sure a lease might work out. But for me, buying a car
It’s actually the opposite of that. In this scenario a lease may not be your best option (you would have to run numbers to find out). Again, you are financing the depreciation, so if your car depreciates a lot, then you are financing more in the lease.
Maybe that’s why they pushed you into buying a new car!!!
Nobody pushed me into jack. They would have much preferred a lease and actually begged me to do a lease. I purchased because it made more sense. Should I assume you got talked into a lease since you automatically think I got talked into a purchase?
“Wailord”
1979 17’ Montauk
90 Johnson
Wilderness Ride 115
quote:
Originally posted by GeronimoIf I had to buy a domestic car I would probably do a lease as well. Let the dealership take a bath on the 50% depreciation on those things.
Again, you are still missing the point… High depreciation = higher lease payment…
I leased my Tundra as well as my last Tundra…
quote:Well, I DID run the numbers... Isn't it obvious who wasn't working with all of the information?
Originally posted by GeronimoNobody pushed me into jack. They would have much preferred a lease and actually begged me to do a lease. I purchased because it made more sense. Should I assume you got talked into a lease since you automatically think I got talked into a purchase?
If they tried to push you into a high lease, it’s because they knew you didn’t know how to break down the numbers and they thought they could hide the details.
If you ran the numbers and you went with a lease, there was still money on the table to be had purchasing that you gave up on.
“Wailord”
1979 17’ Montauk
90 Johnson
Wilderness Ride 115
quote:Says, the guy with "great credit" and a 2.9% APR!!!
Originally posted by GeronimoIf you ran the numbers and you went with a lease, there was still money on the table to be had purchasing that you gave up on.
“Wailord”
1979 17’ Montauk
90 JohnsonWilderness Ride 115
Well, you are just flinging stuff at the wall now, hoping something sticks. I broke it out into calculations above plain to see for the world. You can always come up with some mathematical examples to prove me wrong, but one of us knows what we are talking about, and the other heard Dave Ramsey on tv.
There is no “magic” in a purchase. Everything is on the internet now. Trucar, Edmunds, KBB, etc. NO MAGIC!!!
Again, we like having a new car every 3 years. I’m not the guy who keeps his car for 10 years to buck the system. The lease is the best option in our scenario. I don’t have to worry about the wife and kids driving around town in a beater waiting for the transmission to fall out, or the brakes to go bad.
So what is a credit score?
“Wailord”
1979 17’ Montauk
90 Johnson
Wilderness Ride 115
quote:Another bargaining chip.
Originally posted by GeronimoSo what is a credit score?
“Wailord”
1979 17’ Montauk
90 JohnsonWilderness Ride 115
Sorry, words are so important. 
Meant what is a great credit score. facepalm
“Wailord”
1979 17’ Montauk
90 Johnson
Wilderness Ride 115
skinneej, got a question for you! I went new truck shopping a while back and they salesman jumped all over me! They wanted all my info to run a credit check, before they even knew what I really wanted! I told them they could run the credit check all day long but couldn’t see it, because it was locked! The salesman melted away, like the tide going out! Why did this happen?
quote:
Originally posted by GeronimoSorry, words are so important.
“Wailord”
1979 17’ Montauk
90 JohnsonWilderness Ride 115
quote:
Originally posted by Easyskinneej, got a question for you! I went new truck shopping a while back and they salesman jumped all over me! They wanted all my info to run a credit check, before they even knew what I really wanted! I told them they could run the credit check all day long but couldn’t see it, because it was locked! The salesman melted away, like the tide going out! Why did this happen?
When you roll up on the scene, they try to determine if you are a “tire kicker” that wants to waste their time, or someone who might actually buy a car. If they don’t think you are a serious buyer, they will run to find the next person who is. If you have the word “sucker” stamped on your head, they will want you even worse. They are like sharks. They want an easy meal that doesn’t fight back much.
Guess I got some work to do. Still 17 points to be had somehow.
“Wailord”
1979 17’ Montauk
90 Johnson
Wilderness Ride 115
quote:My point was not that your credit score was or wasn't great. My point was that your interest rate was not indicative of "great". Honestly, I haven't purchased (I lease) a car in 5-6 years, but the last 2 rates we paid were 1.9% and 0.9% and that was score in the 700's.
Originally posted by GeronimoGuess I got some work to do. Still 17 points to be had somehow.
“Wailord”
1979 17’ Montauk
90 JohnsonWilderness Ride 115
So if your credit is great (which I have no reason to believe it isn’t), then you might have left a point on the table… Rates are negotiable.
The point is you can have an 850 credit score and they can say, “Great news, you were approved for an awesome 4% interest rate!!! Good job”. You can’t assume that they will give you the best rate that you can get.
Like you stated, there is no hiding the truth with the internet and I knew what was the best rate at the time. Comparing lease rates, and even special GMC rates is not a fair comparison for a straight purchase and independent financing. So many other things are hidden to get to those 0%-.9% rates. I think my rate today would be around 1.7%-1.9% with an 833 credit score.
We got 0% on our last purchase 9 years ago. Does that mean I am some kind of special negotiator or had a super credit score? No, it means I left $1500 in rebates on the table. Or got “fleeced” into signing a lease.
It’s great that you accept your situation and know that you want a new car every 3 years. A lease works great for your situation and then you have no pressure to try and trade or sell your car. For the few like me that drive one for 8-10 years, and have no fear of breaking down because I know how to maintain a car, a lease is not a good move.
“Wailord”
1979 17’ Montauk
90 Johnson
Wilderness Ride 115