that’s a pretty cool thing to do , i was looking under red fish tagging and couldn’t find the site, , thanks
Looks like in 2003-2004 there was an abundance of redfish and then it dropped off pretty sharply. Anyone remember back then and notice the change?
was that when they had the cold weather and fish kill?
Which is it Toppy? Catch and release works or doesn’t? You can’t seem to make up your mind. Again, release mortality on redfish is less than 1 percent. THAT’S…LESS…THAN…ONE…IN…A…HUNDRED. UNDERSTAND?
quote:<hr hei
Originally posted by toppyblueOh my god!!! now 1 data point has become basis for a scientific study…I am sure there are hundreds if not thousands of tagged fish being caught…A mere drop in the bucket compared to hundreds of thousand or millions not tagged…
It would be interesting to see these numbers::: total fish tagged and released compared to number of these tagged fish caught after release.
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by bonecrusher</i>quote:
Originally posted by OptikerInteresting, I just got a recapture report in the mail today.
Tagged 4/28/11 at 14"
Recaptured 8/29/12 at 22.6"
Recaptured and released 12/12/13 at 27.5"Yeah, catch and release kills em. Clearly.
2000 SeaPro 180CC w/ Yammy 115 2 stroke
1966 13’ Boston Whaler w/ Merc 25 4 stroke “Flatty”
www.ralphphillipsinshore.com | www.summervillesaltwateranglers.com
Personal Trout Slot Limit: 16"-20" Creel: 2
That’s really cool. My daughter want to tag some redfish this summer.
When you get a tagged report, does it give the specific location to where it was caught so you can see how far that fish has traveled, etc.
By the way, that’s one lucky fish. Been caught 3 times and never ended up on the plate of Treemydog or Toppyblue.
Well, Toppy, I keep putting up DATA and you keep putting up OPINIONS. By the way, according to my report from SCDNR, over 85,000 fish have been tagged by DNR, including 64,383 Red Drum. Approx 15% of them have been recaptured. I’m assuming this does not include recreational tagging, of which I have tagged 150 to 200 in the past year, and have had approx 15% recaptured as well. Now, before you go getting your panties in a wad, it’s certain that not 100% of fish get caught on hook and line, so there is no basis for making any kind of statement about release mortality from this.
To answer some questions from others: Anyone can become a rec tagger. You can contact Robert Wiggers (WIGGS on this site) or via dnr.sc.gov . You must buy your own tag gun, for approx $30, then they will supply you with tags, logs, and postage paid return envelopes, as many as you want/need. If you tag regularly, you can request the larger dart tags and tagger and they will provide free of charge. If you really want to get fancy, you can also request a fin clip kit to provide DNA data. I am currently doing this for stripers.
Oh, and bone crusher, when you get a recapture report it has the data from approx where it was caught and its length and whether it was released or retained. I used to provide GPS coords of my tags but thats more detailed than they want/need. Creek or general location is sufficient. I keep more detailed records for myself
2000 SeaPro 180CC w/ Yammy 115 2 stroke
1966 13’ Boston Whaler w/ Merc 25 4 stroke “Flatty”
www.ralphphillipsinshore.com | www.summervillesaltwateranglers.com
Personal Trout Slot Limit: 16"-20" Creel: 2
quote:
Originally posted by bonecrusherquote:
Originally posted by OptikerInteresting, I just got a recapture report in the mail today.
Tagged 4/28/11 at 14"
Recaptured 8/29/12 at 22.6"
Recaptured and released 12/12/13 at 27.5"Yeah, catch and release kills em. Clearly.
2000 SeaPro 180CC w/ Yammy 115 2 stroke
1966 13’ Boston Whaler w/ Merc 25 4 stroke “Flatty”
www.ralphphillipsinshore.com | www.summervillesaltwateranglers.com
Personal Trout Slot Limit: 16"-20" Creel: 2
That’s really cool. My daughter want to tag some redfish this summer.
When you get a tagged report, does it give the specific location to where it was caught so you can see how far that fish has traveled, etc.
By the way, that’s one lucky fish. Been caught 3 times and never ended up on the plate of Treemydog or Toppyblue.
Dont worry unless he dies off of old age ill get him. After all theres only like 12 redfish left in south Carolina so the odds are in my favor.
quote:
Originally posted by paintblendwas that when they had the cold weather and fish kill?
Not sure, I was hoping someone else would answer that.
Click on their link in that article and you will see a totally different story(the numbers of fish netted per year do not match the graph).Where is the data from the past 3 years??Looks like they would keep it up to date?? I dont put much faith in their method as described…schools of reds move around so it would seem logical that they just pulled the nets in a good place one trip and a not so good place the next trip…I spent 20 years in an environmental lab and we shocked up different species in two different reservoirs and two rivers…We did this twice a year for four different species…My point is this:one trip you could shock up 50 fish in a specific location,next trip nothing in the exact locations…fish move reds too.
quote:
Originally posted by InshoreAnglerLooks like in 2003-2004 there was an abundance of redfish and then it dropped off pretty sharply. Anyone remember back then and notice the change?
quote:
Originally posted by toppyblueClick on their link in that article and you will see a totally different story(the numbers of fish netted per year do not match the graph).Where is the data from the past 3 years??Looks like they would keep it up to date?? I dont put much faith in their method as described…schools of reds move around so it would seem logical that they just pulled the nets in a good place one trip and a not so good place the next trip…I spent 20 years in an environmental lab and we shocked up different species in two different reservoirs and two rivers…We did this twice a year for four different species…My point is this:one trip you could shock up 50 fish in a specific location,next trip nothing in the exact locations…fish move reds too.
quote:
Originally posted by InshoreAnglerLooks like in 2003-2004 there was an abundance of redfish and then it dropped off pretty sharply. Anyone remember back then and notice the change?
Red Drum Catch And Release Study Here- http://www.dnr.sc.gov/marine/mrri/insh_fish/reddrum/reddrumportal1.html
Well Optiker,That is very impressive…I see you ctually did research …Bravo! Of the 12,750 fish recaptured,how many were reds? I mean what percentage of the reds were recaptured? 15 % sounds reasonable for juveniles. Thanks for the info.very professional except for the opinion crap.
quote:
Originally posted by OptikerWell, Toppy, I keep putting up DATA and you keep putting up OPINIONS. By the way, according to my report from SCDNR, over 85,000 fish have been tagged by DNR, including 64,383 Red Drum. Approx 15% of them have been recaptured. I’m assuming this does not include recreational tagging, of which I have tagged 150 to 200 in the past year, and have had approx 15% recaptured as well. Now, before you go getting your panties in a wad, it’s certain that not 100% of fish get caught on hook and line, so there is no basis for making any kind of statement about release mortality from this.
To answer some questions from others: Anyone can become a rec tagger. You can contact Robert Wiggers (WIGGS on this site) or via dnr.sc.gov . You must buy your own tag gun, for approx $30, then they will supply you with tags, logs, and postage paid return envelopes, as many as you want/need. If you tag regularly, you can request the larger dart tags and tagger and they will provide free of charge. If you really want to get fancy, you can also request a fin clip kit to provide DNA data. I am currently doing this for stripers.
Oh, and bone crusher, when you get a recapture report it has the data from approx where it was caught and its length and whether it was released or retained. I used to provide GPS coords of my tags but thats more detailed than they want/need. Creek or general location is sufficient. I keep more detailed records for myself
2000 SeaPro 180CC w/ Yammy 115 2 stroke
1966 13’ Boston Whaler w/ Merc 25 4 stroke “Flatty”
www.ralphphi
For goodness sakes you dudes need to get a life. Incredible. The whole lot of you. Entertaining, but in a jaw-dropping kind of way. At what point did fishing merge with…whatever this is?
quote:
Originally posted by toppyblueCome on…there are so many crabs out there one would never sink long enough to decompose and fill with decomposition gasses to float.Talk about a one sided interpretation of facts?
I guess these are more Toppy facts. Dead fish don’t float. That’s a new one to me…
This thread certainly doesn’t disprove your statement:
http://old.charlestonfishing.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=101775&SearchTerms=redfish,terrapin
And the fish in that thread is probably only floating because there are no crabs around… in July.
First i would like to say that I have never changed my mind.Catch and release works,it works it works it works…Creel limits work it works it works it works…!Combined they work they work they work.
EVERY LITTLE BIT HELPS!!! All along I have said this!!Commercial taking of breeders being stopped also worked and that sir is the major contributor to the rebound populations of reds.As for your 1% statement that is a"cherry picked" piece of data from a study of fish hooked in the lip and promptly released…here is some data provided by DNR studies of fish survival when Hooked:
70% of SC fishermen use live or natural bait for reds.
15% use strictly artificial baits
11.8% use a combination artificial and natural
68 % of the natural bait fishermen use Jhooks
Red drum tend to swallow their prey quickly in a vacuuming type motion.52.2% of red drum caught with JHOOKS are deep hooked in the throat or gut and 16.8% of these fish died within three days.
These studies were in controlled aquarium type environment and do not include any data for survival in the actual environment where fatigued and disoriented fish are released into.Shock,stress and predators surely also take a low percentage after release.
There are also survival death rates using other hooks and lures… Some studies in other states claim up to 20 % die when hooked
Most agree that lip hooking and prompt release is less than 1% mortality.
So if you are a 100% lure/lip hooker with prompt release then you sir are stating the truth and I commend you for that.If not,you are a pain in the butt misleading folks(for what i am not sure).
Hopefully the above will explain at least to some, my earlier statements…
This is my position that caused the ruckus:
I fish live/cut baits with(semi) stainless very sharp 2/0 Jhooks that do not corrode easily.With the current creel/size limits I have to catch on average 15 reds to keep three…Some days 20 or more.And usually 2 or three monsters tha
There always has been and always will be exceptions to every rule.Has been and always will be cherry pickers .You could easily have found photos of large fish kills with floating fish to to dispute me.However you chose a very interesting post to belittle me and make you look like some kind of heroe…
That turtle/red thing was , however , amazing!!! thanks for sharing it.And good luck with your ego.
quote:
Originally posted by 23Sailfishquote:
Originally posted by toppyblueCome on…there are so many crabs out there one would never sink long enough to decompose and fill with decomposition gasses to float.Talk about a one sided interpretation of facts?
I guess these are more Toppy facts. Dead fish don’t float. That’s a new one to me…
This thread certainly doesn’t disprove your statement:
http://old.charlestonfishing.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=101775&SearchTerms=redfish,terrapinAnd the fish in that thread is probably only floating because there are no crabs around… in July.
You forgot who thinks you buckshot boats.
quote:
Originally posted by tree_my_dog
I’m actually beginning to feel a bit sorry for you. If you actually believe this crap you write, why would you CHOOSE to continue killing fish with an undersize j-hook? Very few fish are gut-hooked with inline circle hooks, but yet you CHOOSE not to use them, and then boast using stainless or is it semi-stainless which would be even worse. Everything you have posted is a contradiction. Noone has agreed with anything you’ve had to say. Everyone else must be nuts. Right?
quote:
Originally posted by toppyblueFirst i would like to say that I have never changed my mind.Catch and release works,it works it works it works…Creel limits work it works it works it works…!Combined they work they work they work.
EVERY LITTLE BIT HELPS!!! All along I have said this!!Commercial taking of breeders being stopped also worked and that sir is the major contributor to the rebound populations of reds.As for your 1% statement that is a"cherry picked" piece of data from a study of fish hooked in the lip and promptly released…here is some data provided by DNR studies of fish survival when Hooked:
70% of SC fishermen use live or natural bait for reds. 15% use strictly artificial baits 11.8% use a combination artificial and natural68 % of the natural bait fishermen use Jhooks
Red drum tend to swallow their prey quickly in a vacuuming type motion.52.2% of red drum caught with JHOOKS are deep hooked in the throat or gut and 16.8% of these fish died within three days.
These studies were in controlled aquarium type environment and do not include any data for survival in the actual environment where fatigued and disoriented fish are released into.Shock,stress and predators surely also take a low percentage after release.There are also survival death rates using other hooks and lures… Some studies in other states claim up to 20 % die when hooked
Most agr
I told ya! The gift that keeps on giving.
quote:
Originally posted by toppyblueThere always has been and always will be exceptions to every rule.Has been and always will be cherry pickers .You could easily have found photos of large fish kills with floating fish to to dispute me.However you chose a very interesting post to belittle me and make you look like some kind of heroe…
That turtle/red thing was , however , amazing!!! thanks for sharing it.And good luck with your ego.
quote:
Originally posted by 23Sailfishquote:
Originally posted by toppyblueCome on…there are so many crabs out there one would never sink long enough to decompose and fill with decomposition gasses to float.Talk about a one sided interpretation of facts?
I guess these are more Toppy facts. Dead fish don’t float. That’s a new one to me…
This thread certainly doesn’t disprove your statement:
http://old.charlestonfishing.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=101775&SearchTerms=redfish,terrapinAnd the fish in that thread is probably only floating because there are no crabs around… in July.
let me get this straight, so the best way to increase the reds population is to relax the limit on how many we can keep and let us keep smaller fish as well, so to increase the population keep more and smaller fish and that will help , in my thinking if i can fish for three hours or all day i will do that and if i decide to keep my limit of fish i will do that, but my intentions are to fish for a length of time not for my limit of fish, in other words i will release fish if the bite is on and i catch the limit and i do not want to go home, and i think most recreational anglers are that way, so if the limit is six i will keep six and release the rest no matter how many i can catch in that specific time frame, the law says all i can keep is 3 then that is all i would keep in that same time frame so the three i would have to put back would have a possibility of living where if i kept 6 they would all die, so the law you are talking about changing would only work if you caught 6 and went home . and i don’t think most recreational anglers are going to do that
Apparently myself and the majority of s.c. fishermen use j hooks(according to DNR) . Remember i asked you to debate point by point??? not doing so good are you? Me and the majority of fishermen use j hooks. Stainless steel(which is a combination of alloys that doesn’t readily corrode) Is that the best you can do??
Dictating the type hook I should use?? I want to catch and eat my fish!!!I use the one that catches the most fish!!!I dont tell you the best hook for you to catch release…I must be using the correct hook for my needs. The smaller hook allows me to catch grunts/spots/flounder and reds, etc…to eat. You catch/release…i will catch/eat.
Seriously,there should be a law not to mollest fish unless they are eaten(food).I was just trying to suggest a way that seemed reasonable to get both(make you and me happy).Now I am beginning to think HSUS should get involved and stop you from molesting,tramautizing and yes even killing some just for personal pleasure…Think it cant happen???Some places in the world(germany specifically) it is illegal to catch and release a carp.After hooking and landing you must immediately club the fish in the head to prevent suffering).I was there 1969 to 1971(army). Those crazy humaniacs think you are barbaric for what you do…So from now on it should be catch and eat or leave them alone.Go golfing.
Sir I applaud you for releasing fish that are liphooked.
quote:
Originally posted by RADDADDYI’m actually beginning to feel a bit sorry for you. If you actually believe this crap you write, why would you CHOOSE to continue killing fish with an undersize j-hook? Very few fish are gut-hooked with inline circle hooks, but yet you CHOOSE not to use them, and then boast using stainless or is it semi-stainless which would be even worse. Everything you have posted is a contradiction. Noone has agreed with