The definition of a “cull buck” can’t (shouldn’t) be simply defined. A major variable is your management goal/plan. Are you managing for overall herd health and balance? Are you trophy managing? Are you managing age structure? Are you managing for specific genetic traits? You can debate what each of you think a “cull buck” is or is not until you’re blue in the face but until you answer/address some of the questions I mentioned, there isn’t a clear cut answer.
No matter how much it hurts, how dark it gets, or how far you fall…you are never out of the fight.
Exactly bang, that’s why I was wanting a definition, not an argument.
As I mentioned, there is no control of genetics ,or any kind of "selective breeding " unless there is a deer pen operation , which is illegal in SC. High fences are grandfathered, but I’ve had those owners tell me they’ve seen deer jump over them.
Texas and a few other states allow deer pens, complete enclosures, no coming or going . In those areas genetic manipulation will work, but you open up the gates for CWD, and other diseases. Also ,it has been noted that continually removing these young ,"inferior " bucks will result in lower body weights throughout the rest of the herd.
I’ll give you the selective breeding, to an extent, but I disagree that you can’t have “control of genetics” without a pen operation. I’ve hunted places in western KY that manage for 10pt bucks or better. If they encounter a buck that is 3 1/2 years old or older and has less than 10pt, they consider that buck a “management” (or cull) buck. There are places in TX, KS, IA, and IL (that aren’t high-fence or “pen operations”) that do this too.
No matter how much it hurts, how dark it gets, or how far you fall…you are never out of the fight.
Only a guess since I’m just looking at a picture. Looks like a 1 1/2 year old buck by the face and what I can see of the legs (about the only thing showing). I would pass that buck mostly because I would rather eat a doe. There are three main concerns in management. 1 ratio of bucks to does. Should be fairly close, not 8 - 1. 2. Age class. The bucks have to get to 4.5 years before you can really tell what their potential is. 3. Habitat and food. Without good nutrition your herd will never max out their potential.
Most northern/midwest states allow only one buck and a number of does. That helps with the ratio. With only one buck allowed, many younger bucks survive to the older age class. And with the agriculture nutrition is mostly pretty good.
But I don’t think the majority of hunters in SC would go along with the kind of rules they have in other areas, and trying to manage small tracts without the landowners around you doing the same is mostly a waste of effort.
I’d have let it walk unless I was hungry and needed one for the freezer. Give me more to work with. Poor deer has Chineese eyes from the dude pulling them back. If that was a 4 year old deer, Yes he should have been shot if one was wanting to use a little QDM.
I’m just trying get a grasp on all these different bucks…
No you are not. You are just poking at Fred for fun ha,ha.
2012 Skeeter ZX22 Bay
Yamaha 250 hp SHO
Minnkota Riptide 101
He may be attempting in his mind to be poking at me, but I’m enjoying this too.
I’m waiting for Polly to tell me his definition of a “cull” buck. I’m guessing he’d say a 14pt over 200lbs. I’d cull that one too, unless I was on a huge hunk of land (like 20,000 acres or so) and thought no one else would shoot him.
Or perhaps Polly does not believe there is such a thing as a cull deer?
Nice deflect on the scrub buck definition. I addressed the answers to your question in my 3 posts,on page 1, on the 17 th. Read the last sentence,in the last paragraph below.
So, next time you and your hunting buddies discuss the merits of culling bucks to improve genetics, you will be armed with the latest Whitetail Science to help them make more informed decisions. Are there bucks that will never produce quality antlers? Sure, and there are even some legitimate reasons to take them, but genetic improvement is rarely one of them. Simply put, culling is generally used by hunters as an excuse to harvest more bucks and therefore is far more often a pitfall than a panacea.
Nice deflect on the scrub buck definition. I addressed the answers to your question in my 3 posts,on page 1, on the 17 th. Read the last sentence,in the last paragraph below.
So, next time you and your hunting buddies discuss the merits of culling bucks to improve genetics, you will be armed with the latest Whitetail Science to help them make more informed decisions. Are there bucks that will never produce quality antlers? Sure, and there are even some legitimate reasons to take them, but genetic improvement is rarely one of them. Simply put, culling is generally used by hunters as an excuse to harvest more bucks and therefore is far more often a pitfall than a panacea.</font id=“red”>
That’s a pretty broad brush you’re painting with.
No matter how much it hurts, how dark it gets, or how far you fall…you are never out of the fight.
Nice deflect on the scrub buck definition. I addressed the answers to your question in my 3 posts,on page 1, on the 17 th. Read the last sentence,in the last paragraph below.
So, next time you and your hunting buddies discuss the merits of culling bucks to improve genetics, you will be armed with the latest Whitetail Science to help them make more informed decisions. Are there bucks that will never produce quality antlers? Sure, and there are even some legitimate reasons to take them, but genetic improvement is rarely one of them. Simply put, culling is generally used by hunters as an excuse to harvest more bucks and therefore is far more often a pitfall than a panacea.</font id=“red”>
That’s a pretty broad brush you’re painting with.
No matter how much it hurts, how dark it gets, or how far you fall…you are never out of the fight.
Did you even bother to read the link I posted?
This fella wrote the article, not me. He’s a little more qualified…
Brian Murphy is an avid hunter, wildlife biologist and CEO of the Quality Deer Management Association (www.QDMA.com). He has worked exclusively in deer research and management for 25 years during which he has presented more than 600 lectures and authored more than 125 popular and scientific articles, book chapters and other educational materials designed for deer hunters and managers.
Yes, I did read it but it still doesn’t change my opinion. That reminds me, if you don’t want to get called out for something you post that you didn’t actually say, you might want to quote the article. Just like your last “copy and paste” statement on Brian’s “Bio.” For anyone that didn’t/doesn’t read the article, it looks like those are your words. Just a friendly tip.
That said, if Brian Murphy were part of this forum or sitting in my living room, I’d tell him the same thing. I think it’s irresponsible, as a trusted voice in the QDMA community, to make such broad generalizations when describing hunters. If it’s not an irresponsible generalization, what is the sample size of hunters and properties he polled to come up with such a scientific theory?
Settle down, buttercup. You triggered?
No matter how much it hurts, how dark it gets, or how far you fall…you are never out of the fight.
Simply put, culling is generally used by hunters as an excuse to harvest more bucks and therefore is far more often a pitfall than a panacea.
That is a load of crap in (I’d estimate 85%) most all hunters.
I’ve stated over and over that I do not care to kill bucks, I like the meat of a doe. I generally put 2 a year in the freezer and kill one more for my dad. Then I’m given many to pick up with processor fees paid for. Sometimes I barter side work.
I have helped with a few depredation permits and meat always goes to an appreciative home or three. I’ve never just gut shot a deer so I didn’t have to drag it out the field.
no help, I think if you read through what I posted I agreed with your article on injury causing a one sided spike. Also it does not say culling wild deer can not work, only that it is difficult. Which I agree. We’ll never get all hunters to agree to what so many have differing opinions on.
What about a 4 year old two sided spike?
So You never really answered if you have any specific deer you like to “cull”.
Bottom line, there’s no one “do” or “don’t” when it comes to wildlife management. Every management situation is different and it’s not static so if you’re truly managing, your management approach will have to change/adapt to the resource as it is impacted by your management techniques.
As far as the “scrub” and “cull” buck thing, again, aside from medical/injury issues, their definitions are dependent upon your management goals. There’s no one concrete definition.
No matter how much it hurts, how dark it gets, or how far you fall…you are never out of the fight.
