Been hunting deer since 1965 (13 years old) and the train of thought throughout my hunting career has sure changed. Back in the early days, it was kill only bucks and no does, then in the early 70’s, some clubs got doe tags, but we still shot any and every legal buck we saw…then QDM came around and new thoughts and management started happening. I have talked to so many folks in the last couple of years that have different viewpoints…Kill only bucks with an outside spread of “so many inches”, kill every doe you see, kill only young does, not the big “breeder does”, kill “button bucks” late in the season…what do you folks think? What is your philosophy on what to kill?
from a herd management standpoint irregardless of antler size the buck to doe ratio should never exceed 1:2 in SC the ratio has been near 1:7 the last few seasons. I would always choose to shoot a doe over a young buck!
Learn to age the bucks on the hoof and let the young ones walk. Any philosophy advocating shooting buttons or young bucks is just stupid. Don’t cull a 2.5yo buck, wait until they are older and still have the crappy rack, you can’t tell when they are young. Think of that ugly girl in high school that liked you but you didn’t give the time of day, then think of the knockout you saw at the reunion and what could have been.
All does are breeder does, take the ones you want to thin the herd. They eat as much as bucks do, maybe more. 1:2 ratio is a pipe dream for most properties and really isn’t feasible. In SC a 1:4 or 5 is about as good as you could hope for. I’ve seen clubs with about a 1:15 ratio because the dip&@&$ts refused to shoot a doe but shot every single thing with a horn on it. They also wondered why they didn’t kill any big bucks, of course the HC president said that bad genetic bucks didn’t breed either.
Mark
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I’ve been wondering about the buck to doe ration thing lately. I’m in a new club this year with an incredible buck to doe ratio. It’s actually to the point that when you want to kill a doe, half the time you only see bucks. I’ve probably seen 150-200 deer hunting there this year and at least half of them were bucks. My last hunt went 6pt, 4pt, spike, doe, fawn. I had one this year that went 9pt, 8pt, 6pt, 6pt, 4pt, and three does. Even when they were grouped up early in the season. For every group of does I saw there was an equally large group of bachelor bucks. We had the shortest rut ever this year and we suspect the heavy buck population is why.
I wondered if we shouldn’t take some of the bucks in lieu of does to help balance the population. Is there a negative to having such a high buck to doe ratio? The last two years I hunted two different clubs and hardly ever saw a buck. This year I rarely go and don’t see a buck. Funny how things change.
the fewer does there are the harder the compitition is to mate. This produces more scraping fighting and most importantly moving. The weather is of course a huge factor on the rut as well but I have never seen a management situation where there were too few does.
L of course the HC president said that bad genetic bucks didn’t breed either.
That is something QDM people need to realize. Those bad genetic bucks are the ones breeding while the big boys are fighting. It does no good for the big boys to eventually bread the doe if a sneaky “bad genetic” buck has already been there.
Some of the best areas I’ve seen are the ones that take out the “trash” and let the better deer bread for a few years then enjoy a select few trophy bucks. Any doe that looks sickly or small, and all scrub bucks need to go. Takes a lot of land to actually have QDM and a lot of willing surrounding land owners.
I’d say as dog hunting peters out we will all need to step up to the plate and take out a lot of scrub bucks and nannys.
The bad thing is most hunters don’t have the patience or will power to let a trophy walk over a scrub. The other bad side is those same hunters don’t have the patience or will power to not shoot that young cow horn.
i agree with salty on this one 100%. used to hunt in a club down off of sumter hwy in the swamp. the biologist even told us time and again that we had way too many does and to shoot does but the older (in age) men would only let the teenagers shoot does and it got to where the quality of the deer decreased substantially so we found a new club to hunt. years later since the older guard has either passed or too old to get out there the herd has made a pretty good comeback but it took over 20 years for that to happen. i enjoy taking does and if i had my choice side by side unless it was a really nice one i would let the buck go and drop the doe. good groceries
Land can only support so many deer. If you have crops near or within where you hunt, then you can carry a lot more per acre. Hardwoods and briars will hold more in winter while beans, peanuts, peas, etc. will hold more in summer.
Does eat waaaaaay more than bucks. Once rut happens, bucks quit eating and worry about breeding and finding their places, and then after rut, they eat brush and very little other stuff and become pretty much hermits until Spring. Meanwhile, does are eating everything they can for energy and fetus development during winter. Then, they are eating to support suckling fawns in spring, then getting fat for winter during summer and fall. Ever heard “eating for two?” How about eating for three or four!? The more does you have, the more bucks you can have born, but you reach a point of diminishing returns and even a crash if you don’t have enough food. The dominant does will run off young bucks even moreso than the dominant bucks will. That’s how your neighbors will get your bucks that you raised and you lose the gene selection efforts you have been trying to do with your trophy management. Bottom line is you need to feed em or shoot em, and everybody’s property or club is going to be different. Only you know how much water and food you’ve got relative to your herd. There is no one size fits all, but only shooting one or the other for consistent stretches of years, IMO, will eventually be bad for your herd if not initially. An outside the ears rule doesn’t work if you see a 200lb 6 pt that is 4 years old and only 12" wide- or a cowhorn- or an 8pt with 6 pts on one side and 2 on the other without any beam. You have to do more watching than shooting if you want trophies. If you are too proud to shoot does with a high powered rifle, have a man drive or let kids shoot. Why let does get out of control and have your dominant bucks only weigh 160lbs instead of 210lbs? The healthier a buck is, the bigger the rack can grow in summer too… You have to keep your fingers on the pulse and manage it if y
Good point phin. I wish my nieghbors would kill some does. I think the local buck to doe ratio is atleast 1/5. Lee county. With out the agricultural crops they would go hungry. Shame on property owners n hunt clubs that do not provide adequate food plot’s for these animals.
Hauling a few bags of corn to the woods during hunting season is not a food plot.
Good point phin. I wish my nieghbors would kill some does. I think the local buck to doe ratio is atleast 1/5. Lee county. With out the agricultural crops they would go hungry. Shame on property owners n hunt clubs that do not provide adequate food plot’s for these animals.
Hauling a few bags of corn to the woods during hunting season is not a food plot.