Another Johnson w/ a problem....(took to Chris-V)

General Boats and Motors
1

I started to post this in Superfly’s thread, but didn’t want to thread-jack his topic.

I’m scared for my 1996 Johnson 130. A few weekends ago the NO OIL light came on while at low idle. I shut off the motor, waited a minute or 3 and started the engine again. No light. Then it came on again.

I talked to a mechanic and he suggested disconnecting the vro - or at the very least start mixing oil in the gas. First trip after the suggestion, I ran 10 gallons of oil/gas at 50-to-1 through the motor and she ran fine. 2nd trip for the air show, I put 20 gallons of oil/gas in the tank.

The run from Hwy 41 to Shem Creek was flawless - not a skip not a hick-up from the motor. But on the trip back, somewhere around the Wando bridge, the NO OIL light came on and the motor running at 4000rpms would intermittently bog down.

It was kinda like vrmmmmmmm, vrmmmmm, bog, vrmmmmmm, vrmmmmmmm, vrmmmmmm, bog, bog, vrmmmmmm. Rinse and repeat.

I knew I has oil in the gas, I figured the vro sensor was picking up a vro failure.

From the Wando bridge to the Hwy 41 landing, the light took spells of coming on (with the horn) and going off and the motor taking spells of running fine with spells of intermittently bogging down without any drop in rpms.

The line for the landing was long and the Cherubs wanted to explore on Cat Island and I throttled up on plane to 5000rpms and the motor started dropping 500rpms and getting them back real fast like. I limped back to the landing and pulled her out of the water.

I’ve been trying to get a mobile mechanic to work me into his schedule for 2 weeks now to have a look at it. I’m hoping it’s the fuel pump vro that the culprit. I’m hoping it’s not the powerhead - that would put me out of the boat fishing business.

I’m open to hearing what your opinions are on this problem…

“I am constantly amazed at the stupidity of the general public.”
~my dad

Equipment:
190cc Sea Pro w/130 Johnson
1- 15 year old
1

2

doesnt sound like a powerhead issue
the light could be causing power reduction, or if you have been double oiling, you could simply have a plug fouling

www.teamcharlestonmarine.com
www.joinrfa.org

3
quote:
Originally posted by chris V

doesnt sound like a powerhead issue
the light could be causing power reduction, or if you have been double oiling, you could simply have a plug fouling

www.teamcharlestonmarine.com
www.joinrfa.org

Boy, I cringed when I saw you had posted Chris, I was prepared for the worst. If my mobile guy doesn’t show up soon, I’ll bring the Old and Busted to you to fix by mid week. I miss my boat.

Thanks.

“I am constantly amazed at the stupidity of the general public.”
~my dad

Equipment:
190cc Sea Pro w/130 Johnson
1- 15 year old
1 - 11 year old
1 - wife (The Warden)

ECFC

4

If it were mine, I would disconnect & unplug the VRO and simply run mixed fuel. That’s what I did with my (current) 70 'Rude. I also had a 140 'Rude in 1999 that required a powerhead rebuild due to the VRO failing. That was a $1,667 lesson for which I could have bought a lot of gas & oil!

5
quote:
Originally posted by Loosewire

If it were mine, I would disconnect & unplug the VRO and simply run mixed fuel. That’s what I did with my (current) 70 'Rude. I also had a 140 'Rude in 1999 that required a powerhead rebuild due to the VRO failing. That was a $1,667 lesson for which I could have bought a lot of gas & oil!

That’s the plan, but I wanna confirm there isn’t any damage or other causes of the intermittent bogging or loss of power/rpm’s at near WOT.

“I am constantly amazed at the stupidity of the general public.”
~my dad

Equipment:
190cc Sea Pro w/130 Johnson
1- 15 year old
1 - 11 year old
1 - wife (The Warden)

ECFC

6

I think you just need to disconnect the oil sensor. You know you have oil in the gas. The sensor might be trying to put your motor into the S.L.O.W. thing (like it will if it overheats). I’d unplug the sensor and you should have no more problems. ??? I still run my VRO. I don’t know what to say. It works, just how much longer? It just doesn’t seem right to mix 80 gallons on gas at a time. Do any of ya’ll have any problems mixing large quantities of fuel? Shouldn’t make a difference. I don’t think it’d seperate over time. Should just mix right back up on the trailer ride to the ramp. ???

Being superstitious is bad luck.

7
quote:
Originally posted by SCSuperfly

I think you just need to disconnect the oil sensor. You know you have oil in the gas. The sensor might be trying to put your motor into the S.L.O.W. thing (like it will if it overheats). I’d unplug the sensor and you should have no more problems. ??? I still run my VRO. I don’t know what to say. It works, just how much longer? It just doesn’t seem right to mix 80 gallons on gas at a time. Do any of ya’ll have any problems mixing large quantities of fuel? Shouldn’t make a difference. I don’t think it’d seperate over time. Should just mix right back up on the trailer ride to the ramp. ???

Being superstitious is bad luck.

That’s the same reason I never disconnected my VRO. I’d replace it, but I really don’t want to pony up the $400+ to replace it when the disconnect is a lot cheaper.

Whaddaya gonna do.

“I am constantly amazed at the stupidity of the general public.”
~my dad

Equipment:
190cc Sea Pro w/130 Johnson
1- 15 year old
1 - 11 year old
1 - wife (The Warden)

ECFC

8

go to a straight fuel pump and mix your gas. did this 6 years ago with same symtoms and problem went away.

9

I had some similiar issues with my '95 OMCs. I fixed them by removing them from the transom and replacing with 225 Suzuki 4 strokes. It took 2 years of saving $ but I hope my fix works. New power getting installed this week.

10

Well. The problem continues. I had the oil line disconnected and I unplugged the 2 wires and 4 wire connectors and taped them sealed.

I took the boat out and she idled perfect. I got out of Shem Creek and hit the throttle up to 4200-5000rpms - there was a definite intermittent drop in rpms. At 4000rpms seemed to hold pretty stable with no loss of power.

Because of mixing oil (maybe a little over-oiled) in the gas, I got a good smoke cloud, water pump pees OK. I pulled the plugs and they are not gummed or excessively dark - just a little oily and gassy.

Anybody got a bazooka I can borrow?

“I am constantly amazed at the stupidity of the general public.”
~my dad

Equipment:
190cc Sea Pro w/130 Johnson
1- 15 year old
1 - 11 year old
1 - wife (The Warden)

ECFC

11
quote:
Anybody got a bazooka I can borrow?

Surely you being an insurance man and all should know of better way to handle a situation like this.:imp:

12
quote:
Originally posted by kdrake
quote:
Anybody got a bazooka I can borrow?

Surely you being an insurance man and all should know of better way to handle a situation like this.:imp:

Problem is, I’m a little too honest.

You know, I once had a boat claim for a blown powerhead. I drove to the shop and the engine hadn’t been broken down to see the pistons and the lower unit hadn’t been removed to see the water pump. I took a few pictures of the boat and prop, but didn’t take one of the lower unit water intakes. But I did look at them - there was nothing - NOTHING in them.

A week later the shop called me they’d broken down the block and removed the lower unit. This time the lower unit inlet screens were completely caked in river sand and the impeller was impacted with river sand - opinion of the mechanic was that the guy ran over a sandbar and blew up his motor because the intake was clogged.

It was pure BS, but because I had not taken a picture of the intakes on the lower unit, I got burned - bad. The shop is still in business, but believe me, the next time I ever go there, I ain’t gonna believe a thing they tell me. And I’ll photo every nut and bolt from stem to stern.

/I’m still hoping to find an answer on my boat - I am not a very happy boy these days.

“I am constantly amazed at the stupidity of the general public.”
~my dad

Equipment:
190cc Sea Pro w/130 Johnson
1- 15 year old
1 - 11 year old
1 - wife (The Warden)

ECFC

[IMG]http://i59.photobu

13

have you checked for fuel line restrictions? anti-siphon valve? is bulb hard during this phenomenon? have you replaced fuel hoses in the past few years? doesn’t sound oil related if you’re premixing. if it was in fact a vro issue i would expect the engine to go into guardian mode and not rev above 2500. if you’re committed to premix going forward install a standard fuel pump and skip the cost of the vro pump assembly.

14
quote:
Originally posted by dernflatlander

have you checked for fuel line restrictions? anti-siphon valve? is bulb hard during this phenomenon? have you replaced fuel hoses in the past few years? doesn’t sound oil related if you’re premixing. if it was in fact a vro issue i would expect the engine to go into guardian mode and not rev above 2500. if you’re committed to premix going forward install a standard fuel pump and skip the cost of the vro pump assembly.

The bulb was replaced late last fall and a pressure test confirmed the pick-up was not obstructed. I replaced the Racor fuel filter late last summer.

But the erratic running came on around the same time the No Oil light started it’s business and I’ve not really had time to check the fuel system since then. I do run Startron in the fuel.

“I am constantly amazed at the stupidity of the general public.”
~my dad

Equipment:
190cc Sea Pro w/130 Johnson
1- 15 year old
1 - 11 year old
1 - wife (The Warden)

ECFC

15

claim,

I’ve got the same engine, but have not had the issues you describe. If it were mine I would start by checking compression in all 4 cylinders and check your spark. If the compression readings are good and you’ve got good spark coming from each plug wire, that would at least rule two of the three potential culprits out and you could then focus on the fuel/vro issue. All it takes is a spark tester and compression gauge which can be purchased at any auto parts store. Just my 2 cents.

16

I’ve read lots and gotten advice that the issue may be a fuel issue - something between the gas tank and the fuel separator, possible anti-siphon value…etc.

So today, I put a 3 gallon gas tank on the boat side of the Racor fuel filter. I idled out of Shem Creek with a beautiful idle. When I got to the point, I hit the throttle and the boat jumped on plane. I hit WOT and the boat ran excellent with no bogging until I was almost out of the Crab Bank / Shem channel when the boat did a quick “studder.”

Hmmm.

So I ran over to the IWC with no issues and got past the no-wake zone and hit the throttle. It took almost no time for the engine to start wildly dropping rpms and getting them back. I only let this go about 5 seconds and headed back to Shem Creek.

Safely back in the channel, I hit the throttle again - the boat now drops and varies rpms at 3500+. Seems to be getting worse.

I ran out of gas at the mouth of Shem Creek in the external gas tank so I hooked up the internal and idled perfectly back to the landing.

Plugs? Coil? Powerpack? (has less than 10 hours (guesstimated))Piston/rings coming apart?

This is more than a little worriesome - more than the termites that are ravinging my house (I’ll post about that some other day).

“I am constantly amazed at the stupidity of the general public.”
~my dad

Equipment:
190cc Sea Pro w/130 Johnson
1- 15 year old
1 - 11 year old
1 - wife (The Warden)

ECFC

17

Does your tach have the no oil light in it? i have seen the tachs be the culprit of this problem. omc tachs go bad sometimes and send a signal to the power pack to go into shut down mode. if you can get your hands on another tach to test it out, try that before you buy a new one. they arent that cheap.

197 poineer F150

18

claim, from your description I still think it’s fuel related. Have you been able to have someone squeeze the bulb when it starts to bog down? I think chickenhawk 26 may have given good advice. You’ve eliminated everything but the racor and the fuel pump. Due to the fact you got an oiling warning, I’m thinkin’ fuel pump.

19

I hope we can figure it out. Mobile mechanic is supposed to come by Monday and we’re going put in and run around a while. I hope I have an answer tomorrow night.

We’re gonna check plugs, looks for fouling in a cylinder, consider the coil and rule those out. It might be the fuel pump. Racor is not that old, but with the ethanol crap going on, even though I run Startron, it might be the Racor or in-line filter…

Cross your fingers that’s it’s a cheap and easy fix and not rings (I don’t think it is)

“I am constantly amazed at the stupidity of the general public.”
~my dad

Equipment:
190cc Sea Pro w/130 Johnson
1- 15 year old
1 - 11 year old
1 - wife (The Warden)

ECFC

20

No answer today…mechanic can’t come to work on it.

Take a day from work, beg The Warden for her suv to pull the boat to the landing…then, sit by the phone, watch The Doctors on TV.

“I am constantly amazed at the stupidity of the general public.”
~my dad

Equipment:
190cc Sea Pro w/130 Johnson
1- 15 year old
1 - 11 year old
1 - wife (The Warden)

ECFC