quote:I will think about that luxury next time I am snacking on my 65 cent can of starkist canned tuna.
Originally posted by Warblerquote:
Originally posted by CourtlandI blame the advances in medicine and all the do good-ers in the world that keep people alive past their natural death point.
People are not that different than fish. We need to stay alive, reproduce and eat.
We need protein. Fish is an easy source, for now.
BS. Most fish, including YFT, is a luxury. The commercial industry ain’t focused on selling the YFT to the savages in Africa who don’t wear clothes…they want to sell it to industrialized countries who will pay a premium. That’s all fine and dandy until you realize they’re depleting the resource. There are much, much cheaper sources of protein than YFT…know that.
Next time you come in, come heavy, or not at all…
They don’t just net tuna, they net entire schools of bait also.
It’s a double whammy
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quote:
Originally posted by skinneejquote:I will think about that luxury next time I am snacking on my 65 cent can of starkist canned tuna.
Originally posted by Warblerquote:
Originally posted by CourtlandI blame the advances in medicine and all the do good-ers in the world that keep people alive past their natural death point.
People are not that different than fish. We need to stay alive, reproduce and eat.
We need protein. Fish is an easy source, for now.
BS. Most fish, including YFT, is a luxury. The commercial industry ain’t focused on selling the YFT to the savages in Africa who don’t wear clothes…they want to sell it to industrialized countries who will pay a premium. That’s all fine and dandy until you realize they’re depleting the resource. There are much, much cheaper sources of protein than YFT…know that.
Next time you come in, come heavy, or not at all…
For the most part, that ain’t YFT, but more to the point, you won’t see many underdeveloped countries eating canned tuna. They’re much more creative (and disgusting) when it comes to their protein.
Next time you come in, come heavy, or not at all…
quote:Why do we care what underdeveloped countries are eating? They aren't purse seining to feed their own people.
Originally posted by WarblerFor the most part, that ain’t YFT, but more to the point, you won’t see many underdeveloped countries eating canned tuna. They’re much more creative (and disgusting) when it comes to their protein.
quote:
Originally posted by CourtlandI blame the advances in medicine and all the do good-ers in the world that keep people alive past their natural death point.
People are not that different than fish. We need to stay alive, reproduce and eat.
We need protein. Fish is an easy source, for now.
That’s more than science, that is common sense. More people, more demand for protein. Human population is exploding and fish make money.
quote:
Originally posted by WarblerTo me, this is the same as the cobia discussion. When that discussion first started back a couple of months ago, there were several on here who refused to believe the blatantly obvious—that the Broad River cobia were in BIG trouble. They wanted more science. Doesn’t seem to be much question about it now that the prime time is here and virtually no cobia are being caught. Again, science plays a huge part in managing our fisheries, but common sense should too, particularly where science might lag behind just enough to allow the decimation of a fishery.
Next time you come in, come heavy, or not at all…
Warbler, I believe you stated that you don’t fish for cobia? Anyway, I have not noticed a decline in cobia over the last 10 years and actually doing better than in the last 20 years. No science just personal experience.
Very little YFT is canned. Most canned tuna is long fin white albacore. . YFT became much more important in the market place when the CO freezing methods were perfected. CO tuna prepared carefully compares very well to fresh. YFT were not such a hot commodity when they had to be quickly jetted to market fresh.
quote:
Originally posted by WarblerFor the most part, that ain’t YFT, but more to the point, you won’t see many underdeveloped countries eating canned tuna. They’re much more creative (and disgusting) when it comes to their protein.
Come on Warbler, Disgusting? Really. You need to travel and live some. That or actually be truly hungry in your life.
quote:Yes, the other thing that seems to have disappeared is BIRDS... We used to have a ton of them offshore... Did the commercial guys kill those too and sell them as imitation chicken strips? [/quote]
Originally posted by skinneej
Skinneej, the birds follow the big fish and gorge on the left over pieces that the big fish didn’t eat. If the big fish aren’t around the birds are not either…
So you leave an open question and maybe the most important. Are the lack of YFT and BIRDs related to over fishing or lack of Bait fish? Or over fishing the predators and bait fish? I’d love to know how bad our commercial Menhaden fishing has affected things… Maybe climate cycles?
quote:Tunas aren't the only big fish...
Originally posted by Fred67quote:
Originally posted by skinneejYes, the other thing that seems to have disappeared is BIRDS… We used to have a ton of them offshore… Did the commercial guys kill those too and sell them as imitation chicken strips?
Skinneej, the birds follow the big fish and gorge on the left over pieces that the big fish didn’t eat. If the big fish aren’t around the birds are not either…
So you leave an open question and maybe the most important. Are the lack of YFT and BIRDs related to over fishing or lack of Bait fish? Or over fishing the predators and bait fish? I’d love to know how bad our commercial Menhaden fishing has affected things… Maybe climate cycles?
So have we a consensus?
I see a link in all the posts regardless of what is written.
Us!
We catch them, eat them, kill them, poison the water, heat up the water, catch the bait. Whatever the reason, we are the cause according to this thread.
We should all be looking in the mirror when we point the finger. Don’t try to give me some BS either as you back out the garage in in your Prius that you are not part of the problem.
Commercial, recreational, poor, rich…the fish aren’t killing themselves. Now what?
quote:
Originally posted by Fred67quote:
Originally posted by WarblerFor the most part, that ain’t YFT, but more to the point, you won’t see many underdeveloped countries eating canned tuna. They’re much more creative (and disgusting) when it comes to their protein.
Come on Warbler, Disgusting? Really. You need to travel and live some. That or actually be truly hungry in your life.
I’m not talking about food that tourists eat…the truly underdeveloped and third world folks eat some nasty stuff out of necessity…I’m not judging them for it…that’s just how they get their protein.
Next time you come in, come heavy, or not at all…
quote:
Originally posted by CourtlandSo have we a consensus?
I see a link in all the posts regardless of what is written.
Us!
We catch them, eat them, kill them, poison the water, heat up the water, catch the bait. Whatever the reason, we are the cause according to this thread.
We should all be looking in the mirror when we point the finger. Don’t try to give me some BS either as you back out the garage in in your Prius that you are not part of the problem.
Commercial, recreational, poor, rich…the fish aren’t killing themselves. Now what?
I don’t buy YFT in the store, so I’m doing my part. And don’t put me in the “environmental causes” camp…I still think this is almost all about commercial fishermen netting every last tuna they can…and a hell of a lot of baitfish, too. Until we figure out a way to cripple the purse seiners, we’re pissing in the wind.
Next time you come in, come heavy, or not at all…
Maybe those Whale Wars people can get on this… those crazy hippies need something to do!
“mr keys”
Warbler, it is similar to the bait vs tuna argument. Fish follow the bait, can’t really have one without the other. The commercial fisherman service the demand. You can try and burn down the commercial fleet all you want but if the demand for fine yellowfin steaks is still there, someone with more money and business savvy than you and I will find another way to harvest the fish and get them to market. A much more holistic gameplan will be required.
Do not tell fish stories where the people know you; but particularly, don’t tell them where they know the fish.
- More Maxims of Mark, Johnson, 1927
31’ Contender
“Touche”
250 HPDIs
quote:
Originally posted by ToucheWarbler, it is similar to the bait vs tuna argument. Fish follow the bait, can’t really have one without the other. The commercial fisherman service the demand. You can try and burn down the commercial fleet all you want but if the demand for fine yellowfin steaks is still there, someone with more money and business savvy than you and I will find another way to harvest the fish and get them to market. A much more holistic gameplan will be required.
Do not tell fish stories where the people know you; but particularly, don’t tell them where they know the fish.
- More Maxims of Mark, Johnson, 1927
31’ Contender
“Touche”
250 HPDIs
No question, but when you’re dealing with a public resource (no one person or entity owns the fish), you need to regulate in a way that protects the resource. This is one of those cases where the free market needs good regulation…unlike, say, a cattle farmer who is responsible for his own herd. Again, I don’t have the answers, but I imagine this will have to involve the State department to sway other countries to cripple these commercial rogues.
Next time you come in, come heavy, or not at all…
Why does the conversation always stop at preventing consumption instead of trying to figure out how to increase production?
You guys keep talking about the expansion of humans on the Earth, but you want to argue about who get’s to take a slice of a finite pie… Mathematically, you either have to keep restricting people from the pie or make the pie smaller each year. When do we start talking about making more pies???
quote:
Originally posted by skinneejWhy does the conversation always stop at preventing consumption instead of trying to figure out how to increase production?
You guys keep talking about the expansion of humans on the Earth, but you want to argue about who get’s to take a slice of a finite pie… Mathematically, you either have to keep restricting people from the pie or make the pie smaller each year. When do we start talking about making more pies???
Maybe it’s an ignorant viewpoint on my part but I see it as we are working with a finite # of resources. I take growing production to mean make more tuna for more people to eat? They can only grow based on forage available. If you are mass-harvesting both baitfish and tuna I’m not sure how any of that works out. I feel like you may be leading the discussion towards fish farms and I really don’t have the time or energy this morning to dive into that discussion.
Do not tell fish stories where the people know you; but particularly, don’t tell them where they know the fish.
- More Maxims of Mark, Johnson, 1927
31’ Contender
“Touche”
250 HPDIs
quote:
Originally posted by skinneejWhy does the conversation always stop at preventing consumption instead of trying to figure out how to increase production?
You guys keep talking about the expansion of humans on the Earth, but you want to argue about who get’s to take a slice of a finite pie… Mathematically, you either have to keep restricting people from the pie or make the pie smaller each year. When do we start talking about making more pies???
Unfortunately that is a short term solution. Matter does not increase or decrease, it only changes form. You can shift the paradigm but only for so long.
quote:Regarding a finite amount of resources.. We are isolating huge amounts of protein and minerals from being reinvested into the global food chain... sealed caskets and vaults.
Originally posted by Courtlandquote:
Originally posted by skinneejWhy does the conversation always stop at preventing consumption instead of trying to figure out how to increase production?
You guys keep talking about the expansion of humans on the Earth, but you want to argue about who get’s to take a slice of a finite pie… Mathematically, you either have to keep restricting people from the pie or make the pie smaller each year. When do we start talking about making more pies???
Unfortunately that is a short term solution. Matter does not increase or decrease, it only changes form. You can shift the paradigm but only for so long.
Regarding forage fish, commercial netting of forage species is the largest commercial fishery in the world accounting for 30% (weight) of all harvest.
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