Never really paid much attention to Giuliani before… But, he doesn’t seem to ignore that the positive community reaction to this horrible tragedy is a Christian centered act of love and forgiveness, not just the reaction of a “good city”. This is probably one of the biggest events in modern day history that had a such a textbook witness to Jesus Christ to the USA and the world in modern times, but it seems to be quickly getting stripped down to secular labels like "#CharlestonStrong, #CharlestonUnited, #ChimeWithCharleston, #TakeItDown, ", etc.
Don’t get me wrong. I’m proud of the reaction that this city is having, but it seems that people are attributing this too much to notion of “that’s how we do it in Charleston”… Seems to me that people should be saying, “that’s how we do it with Jesus”…
I’m sure that I will be chastised in one form or another, but my point is, we need to give credit where the credit is REALLY due… Don’t lose this opportunity to spread the message that is way more important…
I agree with this skinneej. I have witnessed some powerful faith at times, but nothing like the people that have been most directly impacted by this event. These families are the reason that the community has reacted the way they have. Every one of these victims were having a positive impact on their communities in a way that makes many of us realize we need to be doing more. I have a good friend that is a minister that relayed some of the memorial services he attended and came away in awe of the faith these families and their loved ones have. There were very few dry eyes in our service yesterday as we prayed and lifted up these families and our entire community.
So what do you consider the support from the secular or non Christian folks to be?
The support, love, pain we are sharing… the key word is we - meaning all.
What you should take from this - look at how many non Christians come together to support Christians - without pretense or judgement.
Westboro baptist morons are planning a protest of the funeral and demonstrations - they are doing so in the name of God and Jesus, claiming the shooter was doing Gods bidding his actions need to be accepted as such. The local secular group is planning a counter protest, calling for all stand in front of these morons and block their message at all cost - and they are doing so based on what is the right thing to do.
So what do you consider the support from the secular or non Christian folks to be?
You mean in Baltimore, or in Charleston?
I honestly believe that things could have been different without a strong Christian presence here. Many people will react along with their community. Love and forgiveness is quite contagious… I think that the families of the victims set the pace. I don’t remember the same reaction over the Walter Scott killing. As a matter of fact, it was headed in the opposite direction - hate and division.
quote:
The support, love, pain we are sharing… the key word is we - meaning all.
What you should take from this - look at how many non Christians come together to support Christians - without pretense or judgement.
Christians love non-Christians. At least TRUE Christians do. No, what I take from this is that this tragedy happened to fall on a group of TRUE Christians and they gave a TRUE Christian response, just as Jesus would have done. And, just as Jesus has told BILLIONS of people in the past, his way works…
quote:
Westboro baptist morons are planning a protest of the funeral and demonstrations - they are doing so in the name of God and Jesus, claiming the shooter was doing Gods bidding his actions need to be accepted as such. The local secular group is planning a counter protest, calling for all stand in front of these morons and block their message at all cost - and they are doing so based on what is the right thing to
I agree with this skinneej. I have witnessed some powerful faith at times, but nothing like the people that have been most directly impacted by this event. These families are the reason that the community has reacted the way they have. Every one of these victims were having a positive impact on their communities in a way that makes many of us realize we need to be doing more. I have a good friend that is a minister that relayed some of the memorial services he attended and came away in awe of the faith these families and their loved ones have. There were very few dry eyes in our service yesterday as we prayed and lifted up these families and our entire community.
My thoughts 100%!!! The families gave a VERY POWERFUL witness\testimony for Jesus Christ through love and forgiveness that it would be impossible for someone to do without this kind of deep faith. It was based on a DEEP FAITH, not just the fact that they were "from Charleston". That is my reason to post this, because I honestly believe that is the point they want people to see, that they are #ChristianStrong, not just #CharlestonStrong...
Jughed,
I would call your support great. I don’t think because I believe faith set the tone eary on that somehow your support is less than anyone else’s support. I would also submit that plenty of Christians offer support for non-Christians without pretense or judgment. When I see someone in need, I don’t stop to think are they a Christian or not. I would agree that the folks of Westboro seem to be misguided and extreme from what I know about them, just as there are non-believers that we can point to and say they same about. I am careful not to let the actions of a few shape my opinion of any group as a whole.
The families gave a VERY POWERFUL witness\testimony for Jesus Christ through love and forgiveness that it would be impossible for someone to do without this kind of deep faith.
That is a big old assumption right there… Please correct me if I am mistaken, but this is quite the stereotype. I would put forth that all sorts of reactions (forgiving and non-forgiving) would probably be presented by all sorts of folks (secular and non-secular).
Granted, Charleston is known as the holy city, and has a large religious base, but religious folks don’t corner the market on forgiving. What gets to me is when people speak in absolutes, e.g., “everyone”, “no one”, “100%”, “only way”…
This was a horrific tragedy and most everyone in the city and surrounding area is reacting with kindness, passion, and forgiveness.
Jughed,
I would call your support great. I don’t think because I believe faith set the tone eary on that somehow your support is less than anyone else’s support. I would also submit that plenty of Christians offer support for non-Christians without pretense or judgment. When I see someone in need, I don’t stop to think are they a Christian or not. I would agree that the folks of Westboro seem to be misguided and extreme from what I know about them, just as there are non-believers that we can point to and say they same about. I am careful not to let the actions of a few shape my opinion of any group as a whole.
Again, well said!!!
Yes, sorry if I didn’t articulate my thoughts better. Support from non-Christians is great and wonderfully accepted!!! Let there be no mistake about it. Support is support, love is love.
My point of this was to not say that one is better than other, but only to say that the love and support from this community was a pace that was set from the families of the victims. If they had responded with hate, vengeance, and accusations of racism, this could have turned out a lot differently.
My point is just not to diminish the Christian witness that the families gave in place of secular Charleston pride.
The families gave a VERY POWERFUL witness\testimony for Jesus Christ through love and forgiveness that it would be impossible for someone to do without this kind of deep faith.
That is a big old assumption right there… Please correct me if I am mistaken, but this is quite the stereotype. I would put forth that all sorts of reactions (forgiving and non-forgiving) would probably be presented by all sorts of folks (secular and non-secular).
Granted, Charleston is known as the holy city, and has a large religious base, but religious folks don’t corner the market on forgiving. What gets to me is when people speak in absolutes, e.g., “everyone”, “no one”, “100%”, “only way”…
This was a horrific tragedy and most everyone in the city and surrounding area is reacting with kindness, passion, and forgiveness.
John
15’ Ocean Kayak Scupper Pro
You can honestly say that you would have ***forgiven*** someone who massacred your family? Dude, I am a Christian and I wouldn't trust myself to be in that same scenario and react in a way that Jesus wants me to. I think that it would be incredibly tough. Why would a non-Christian forgive someone who massacred their family? They don't have any ideological\religious reason to do so...
We’ve seen secular reactions recently: Walter Scott, Ferguson, Baltimore, etc… Do you really think it was just “Charleston”? I’ll take that assumption any day…
I am in no way saying that Westboro represents anything… just pointing out how everyone is coming together for this, regardless of beliefs.
And yes, I believe its a Charleston thing. Believe it or not, Baltimore county has a higher % of Christians than Charleston County. So why the difference in reaction(s)? The people in general in the Charleston area simply act like humans, regardless of religion.
Good post Skineej, and I definitely agree. God is using Charleston to show the world the He is the true source of love and peace. I’ve never been as proud of a group of people as I am proud of Charleston right now. You guys that live there should be thankful.
It’s good to see the secular and sacred communities coming together. I think lots of secular people are just too stubborn and proud to admit that they need God. Praying that this week’s events will soften their hearts so that they can receive the salvation that is freely offered to them.
If you’re lucky enough to be fishing, you’re lucky enough.
So what do you consider the support from the secular or non Christian folks to be?
The support, love, pain we are sharing… the key word is we - meaning all.
What you should take from this - look at how many non Christians come together to support Christians - without pretense or judgement.
Westboro baptist morons are planning a protest of the funeral and demonstrations - they are doing so in the name of God and Jesus, claiming the shooter was doing Gods bidding his actions need to be accepted as such. The local secular group is planning a counter protest, calling for all stand in front of these morons and block their message at all cost - and they are doing so based on what is the right thing to do.
Skineej isn’t saying that non-Christians aren’t doing things right. He is saying that we should give credit where credit is due: to Jesus. Not to Christians, or non-Christians, or to Charleston. Just Jesus.
If you’re lucky enough to be fishing, you’re lucky enough.
Don’t get me wrong. I’m proud of the reaction that this city is having, but it seems that people are attributing this too much to notion of “that’s how we do it in Charleston”… Seems to me that people should be saying, “that’s how we do it with Jesus”…
It’s inclusive of all. Doesn’t require Christianity to play nice and not burn down your own neighborhood. Is it helpful? Absolutely. But saying #ChristianStrong should represent Charleston is alienating all the secular folks who aren’t also burning down their neighborhoods.
Make a meme for it if you feel so inclined. I’m sure you’ll have people participating. Facts are the only real commonality between ALL the people in Charleston behaving positively is they’re from Charleston.
Don’t get me wrong. I’m proud of the reaction that this city is having, but it seems that people are attributing this too much to notion of “that’s how we do it in Charleston”… Seems to me that people should be saying, “that’s how we do it with Jesus”…
It’s inclusive of all. Doesn’t require Christianity to play nice and not burn down your own neighborhood. Is it helpful? Absolutely. But saying #ChristianStrong should represent Charleston is alienating all the secular folks who aren’t also burning down their neighborhoods.
Make a meme for it if you feel so inclined. I’m sure you’ll have people participating. Facts are the only real commonality between ALL the people in Charleston behaving positively is they’re from Charleston.
Sometimes, non-Christians do God's will even if they don't know they are doing it... This is EXACTLY why Christians are commanded to be the "light of the world" and to witness to other's through their ACTIONS. When something is a "light", it allows others to see through darkness...
Again, I’m not the only one saying it. Did you watch the Giuliani video? He attributed the reaction of Charleston to “deep faith in Jesus Christ”…
If you don’t want to recognize it then don’t! This message really is not to exclude non-Christians, but it was certainly purposely to remind Christians to see that it was Christ working here, not just “Charleston”.