I have seen a lot of people talk about the double drop rig
ie: long leader with two loops in the middle and weight at the end.
my question is, why weight at the end? i go with about a 2 ft leader with one loop in the middle and one at the end. I then put my weight in the middle and hook at the end. is there anything wrong or reason why weight at the end is better? My reason is that if the fish is toothy and ends up cutting the line, most of the time it takes just the hook and i sill have my weight.
also, with these long leaders yall use, isn’t it aggravating that you have all that dragging due to the swivel being close to the rod and then like 3.5 feet of mono hangin? haha just some questions to pass the time
You will miss alot of bites. My rods stay in the spikes 100% of the time, lines tight. Weight before the hook, with a longer leader; bait/hook is free to float and move around with wave and current. Fish can bite with out even moving the rod. Weight at the end of the rig; short 4"-6" leaders, when a fish bumps the bait you will know. Even when the mud minnows, baby pinfish are machine gunning or crabs chewing your bait, you can see it. With a dropper rig, hooks are tight on the MAIN line, carolina rig (weight before), hook is not tight…at all really, main line is tight on the sinker. And I know " natural presentation" …the target fish are mostly opportunistic, bottom feeding Drum. You could probably use anchor rope and the fish would still bite. In the surf, I think, keys are tight lines, just enough weight to hold, smaller hooks on short leaders, and special magic orange beads. IMO.
quote:
Originally posted by dparker677
You will miss alot of bites. My rods stay in the spikes 100% of the time, lines tight. Weight before the hook, with a longer leader; bait/hook is free to float and move around with wave and current. Fish can bite with out even moving the rod. Weight at the end of the rig; short 4"-6" leaders, when a fish bumps the bait you will know. Even when the mud minnows, baby pinfish are machine gunning or crabs chewing your bait, you can see it. With a dropper rig, hooks are tight on the MAIN line, carolina rig (weight before), hook is not tight…at all really, main line is tight on the sinker. And I know " natural presentation" …the target fish are mostly opportunistic, bottom feeding Drum. You could probably use anchor rope and the fish would still bite. In the surf, I think, keys are tight lines, just enough weight to hold, smaller hooks on short leaders, and special magic orange beads. IMO.
As always D, you give me a bunch of good information. I appreciate it. Will probably change my rigs out now with the good fall season getting ready to be upon us!
Thanks again and hope to see you out there. If you see me (usually with fam but if alone just me and my blue chair with two poles haha) feel free to say hi 
David,
Do you use drop rigs even to try and catch big reds ? Like you I use drop rigs for most all surf fishing, but I do have one rod rigged with a fish finder and a big circle hook for the big boys. Thanks for all the the good info you give out.
Jack Taylor
2x what Papa said Mr Parker is one of the best , most knowledgeable , most active surf fisherman on cf’s site , hes a great asset and when he talks I listen cause what hes got to say is valuable , ok there I said it Mr Parker now can I have a bag of those double drop rigs.
I use a 60# wire single drop, about 30" of 50# mono (rub leader), 25# mono main line. This is as Big as I go. I put two of these in use…more towards the end of this month until Dec. Reels are Quantum Boca 70s on 9’ med heavy rods. After Dec. they are cleaned and stored. Rods get 50s put back on.
“There’s a fine line between fishing and standing in the surf like an idiot.”
so your rigs that you buy are the wire drop line with the mono on it correct? do you get them locally here or internet, etc?
I’m going to try that next trip, which I hope will be this weekend.
Thanks again.
Jack Taylor
quote:
Originally posted by papajohick
so your rigs that you buy are the wire drop line with the mono on it correct? do you get them locally here or internet, etc?
Pretty sure I have seen them at haddrell’s.
quote:
Originally posted by papajohick
so your rigs that you buy are the wire drop line with the mono on it correct? do you get them locally here or internet, etc?
Basic 12" single wire drop. I do change the snap swivel at the hook to a 60#. And change to a #14 connecting link at the weight. I prefer Sea Striker rigs but have used Hurricane and some no names and the tackle shops. I don’t use the Hurricane brand mono drops, they have bad crimps and fail often. I buy local and the internet.
A fish finder rig is an excellent set-up. I do use them alot…just not in the surf. From a boat anchored in current they work great, anchor in the front, rods off the back. Dragging minnows around for Flounder, Reds, Specks, perfect. From a river bank for Catfish, casting big’ol plastic worms in deep water for Largemouth even more fun. There is so much movement of water in the surf the bait will move in, out, left, right, up and down. So with a 20" leader that movement can be 40"… [:0] And the fish can and do move your bait that distance, undetected at times.
quote:
Originally posted by dparker677
I do change the snap swivel at the hook to a 60#.
Have you noticed if the fish bite better when the hook is just tied on instead of off a snap swivel, or does it just not really matter?
quote:
Originally posted by peteclat
Have you noticed if the fish bite better when the hook is just tied on instead of off a snap swivel, or does it just not really matter?
Soooo…that big hook is LESS metal than the swivel? If you tied a Mullet up in an anchor rope and thru it in the surf, the fish would eat it. So to me it really doesn’t matter. Those aren’t Brook Trout out there. And most of the time it’s a murky, some what violent environment. The fish will eat what they can find. I never reuse hooks, the snaps make it quick to remove them. I do mash the snaps closed for a little extra strength.
quote:
Originally posted by dparker677
quote:
Originally posted by peteclat
Have you noticed if the fish bite better when the hook is just tied on instead of off a snap swivel, or does it just not really matter?
Soooo…that big hook is LESS metal than the swivel? If you tied a Mullet up in an anchor rope and thru it in the surf, the fish would eat it. So to me it really doesn’t matter. Those aren’t Brook Trout out there. And most of the time it’s a murky, some what violent environment. The fish will eat what they can find. I never reuse hooks, the snaps make it quick to remove them. I do mash the snaps closed for a little extra strength.
What do you mean reuse hooks Mr. Parker?
Hooks go in the trash after each trip.
gotcha thanks for the clarification.
I personally think that folks go way overboard when tying rigs for nearly everything. Particularly for big red drum. Tie a swivel to 6 inches of 80# mono, and then snell on a 7/0 non-offset circle and you are ready to drum fish. Just thread an appropriate sinker and a bead on the line before tying on the rig and you are ready to fish.
You only need a few inches of teeth/rub protection above the circle hook (if used correctly). My biggest annoyance is to see people using circle hooks but then letting a fish run with the bait before applying any pressure. When using circle hooks from a rod holder on pier/boat you should fish with the reel in gear, with full fighting drag, at all times. The fish will immediately load the rod and hook itself every time. Letting a large red drum run with the bait before a “hookset” is irresponsible and will result in deeply hooked fish.
If you are fishing from the beach, using a sand spike, then it’s understandable that you will have a loose drag to start. However, the instant that you can reach the rod during a run, the drag should be immediately tightened to fighting drag so the rod loads smoothly and hooks the fish.
I drives me crazy to watch a majority of fishermen still using circle hooks incorrectly by allowing a fish to run with a bait or by overcomplicating rigging. By simplifying your rigs and simplifying your hooking technique, you’ll catch far more fish as well.
Exactly, I will add, I use a rub leader to keep the fish off of the main line. In my case only 25# mono. Those Bull Reds in the 40"-50" range can be hard to turn on thier initial run, in the surf. They also tend to fight head down pulling straight out, tail whacking your main line the whole way. From a boat or pier your line angle is alot steeper. Line angle is closer to perpendicular rather than paralell, running down the back. And for me, the cable is more for the Sharks and big Rays that you WILL hook while Bull Red fishing. As far as drag…I keep mine the same all the time and adjust as needed during the fight. Never really “loose” though.
quote:
Originally posted by Fishingaddict
I personally think that folks go way overboard when tying rigs for nearly everything. Particularly for big red drum. Tie a swivel to 6 inches of 80# mono, and then snell on a 7/0 non-offset circle and you are ready to drum fish. Just thread an appropriate sinker and a bead on the line before tying on the rig and you are ready to fish.
You only need a few inches of teeth/rub protection above the circle hook (if used correctly). My biggest annoyance is to see people using circle hooks but then letting a fish run with the bait before applying any pressure. When using circle hooks from a rod holder on pier/boat you should fish with the reel in gear, with full fighting drag, at all times. The fish will immediately load the rod and hook itself every time. Letting a large red drum run with the bait before a “hookset” is irresponsible and will result in deeply hooked fish.
If you are fishing from the beach, using a sand spike, then it’s understandable that you will have a loose drag to start. However, the instant that you can reach the rod during a run, the drag should be immediately tightened to fighting drag so the rod loads smoothly and hooks the fish.
I drives me crazy to watch a majority of fishermen still using circle hooks incorrectly by allowing a fish to run with a bait or by overcomplicating rigging. By simplifying your rigs and simplifying your hooking technique, you’ll catch far more fish as well.
I hear ya. I definitely don't let it run. I learned that my first outing due to the guy I was with told me to let it go. Once I started reeling and brought it it, it was hooked back in its throat. Thankfully I had my long pliers on me and I was able to get the hook out and the fish swam away strongly but decided not to sldo that again. I keep my drag ju
A note about rub leaders, I use 30"± on my Red rods, plus the 12" rig gives me 35"-40" of heavier line where it will contact the fish. Which is plenty for most Bull Reds you may hook in the surf. I hooked a decent shark on Sat. on a small rig, 15# mono, half a piece of shrimp, #2 j-hook. Definatly not a Sharpnose. Got a pretty good look at the dorsal and tail as it was “quikly” swimming up the beach. Looked to be a healthy Finetooth or Blacknose, Line gave up after about 100-150yards of drag tweeking. With a Rub leader, I probably could have turned it. But instead I lost a $4 sinker! 