looks like I’ve missed a few updates here, not much to see anyway. Been putting glass on the stringers. What a PITA.
Spent a good bit of time sanding down the glass stickers and stitching from the previous layer and patching up a few spots along the fillets in the back where I had some voids
Also opened up the limber holes I had previously drilled into the coosa core but then glassed over with first two layers. 2" PVC to provide a drain channel, bedded in with thickened resin. Cut the PVC off flush with the outboard side of stringers. Probably overkill but only took a few extra minutes and I don’t have to worry about trying to wrap glass under/around/into a hole or having a place for water to work its way up into the stringer.
trick for filling icing bags (which work great for apply thickened resin by the way): put the bag in a big plastic cup and cuff the top over, holds it open nicely while you scoop resin in. The twist tie to keep top of bag shut is key, otherwise you will eventually end up with a huge mess.
stringers look like hell but that’s because I hit them with the sander
drain channel in
next layer of glass on, thats 2 1808 with 1 1708 in between.
Think I am going to stick to original plan and lay down one more layer of 1708 as soon as the weather clears up again.
I have used icing bags for all types of work, never thaught of using them for the resin! Great idea and can see the twist ties working.
yeah they work great! I was wasting $$ on the refillable caulking tubes but at ~$3 each that wasn’t working for me. I got like a dozen bags for $2 or so at Walmart, even got a metal metal round icing tip that works great for laying out a consistent bead for $0.99. Bags come in a large and small size and hold up fine to the resin.
well, doesn’t look much different from the last few pics, but major milestone accomplished tonight - stringers are completely glassed!
24 yds of 1808
24 yds of 1708
about 20 gallons of resin
a whole box of gloves
sh*tload of rollers, drop cloths, etc
more work, sweat, and frustration than I care to admit.
But (**(), this thing’s going to be a tank! Really glad to be done with that mess - finally feels like I’m starting to get somewhere, should be more building than demolition from here on out.
Still need to finalize locations of transverse bulkheads, which goes along with deciding on tank size and placement. Once I have a final play for the layout, I will order a tank. While I wait on that I’ll work on getting bulkheads in, glassing ledgers to the hull to support the edges of the deck, making the in-deck fishbox inserts, molding hatches/gutters for all the deck hatches, installing chase tubes, etc etc etc.
not much work accomplished but a lot of measuring and thinking. Wanted to make sure I am happy with the placement of fishboxes and fuel tank before I started placing bulkheads, since once I do the compartment layout is pretty much locked in.
very rough mock ups, but really helps get a feel for sizes and layouts. Think I have a plan that works, will mock the bulkheads next.
the fuel tank mockup equates to about 115 gal. It’s only 60" long, compared to the 112" the original coffin+tank occupied. Will free up a lot of space under the deck. Unfortunately, since I’m keeping the tank centered just forward of the original location, most of that extra space will be under the leaning post or very forward end of the console, so not super useful in terms of making it into easy access storage. Still working on what to do with all that bilge space.
Fishboxes are 60" long, not as deep as I would like but there just isn’t enough space under the deck, especially with any insulation. With about 1-2" of insulation on all sides they are about 11" deep and will hold about 100 qts. Big enough to hold one or two larger fish each, and I will have other boxes for smaller stuff. If it gets to the point that I’m catching so many huge fish that isn’t adequate I’ll get a bag…
Not sure if I should try to recycle the original fishbox lids, which are pretty nice and in good shape but smaller than the planned box or just build new ones.
Would it be too much of a pain to have a hatch that is not the full length of box? seems like it could be ok, and I could prob get away with using one latch which seems much more convenient. But don’t want to make it hard to load/unload/clean them either. Boxes are 60" long, the old hatches are about 37".
weather sucks here this weekend, so looking for projects I can do in the garage. May start messing with making molds for fishboxes and hatches.
without a full lid on that small of a box, its gonna be VERY difficult to clean.
As for loading, if you do go with the old lid, off center it as much as you can to one end as possible.
its easy to stick a dolphin head first into a skinny hole.
you have to decide how much effort it will take to make new lids and gutters versus how much effort you will spend washing fish boxes.
without a full lid on that small of a box, its gonna be VERY difficult to clean.
As for loading, if you do go with the old lid, off center it as much as you can to one end as possible.
its easy to stick a dolphin head first into a skinny hole.
you have to decide how much effort it will take to make new lids and gutters versus how much effort you will spend washing fish boxes.
yeah I’m leaning towards just making new hatches and gutters. Drop in the bucket at this point. Boxes will be 5 ft long, using old hatches the opening would be about 3 ft, reaching armpit deep into a slimy fish box to scrub it out does not sound awesome.
I may try to build a mold for the boxes that incorporates a gutter and then I’ll just glass the whole thing down into the deck. Hatches are relatively easy.
decisions, decisions. gives me something to do when the weather doesn’t allow me to do actual work.
OK, still wrestling with tank placement to keep the boat balanced and maximize useful space below the deck. Based on my rough calculations the center of the tank needs to be with 96-120" from the transom. I can use the placement of batteries (forward or aft in console) to compensate for movement in that range, and since it’s already near the CG of the boat slight fwd/aft differences don’t have too big of an effect. But ultimately physics says it has to go near the center of the boat (duh).
I might be able to squeeze out some useful step-down area or at least storage under the front of the console if I bring the tank to the back of that range. But there’s really no way around the tank being under the console unless I split it into two tanks, and I don’t want to do that.
everything here is scale to actual dimensions. Notional console and leaning post bounding boxes roughly based on original sizes and placement.
Dang Mdaddy, where did you learn all those big words I can’t talk that educated even when I haven’t had any Bud lites! I have re done 5 boats with closed transons and outboard brackets all home made and each has been a learning experance. The boat I just finished I installed the bracket to high and had to run the motor in the lowest trim position and could not trim it up with out sticking the bow in the air. I lowered it 3" and works perfectly. I epoxied a 1/2 dowel and hammered it in the old bolt holes 1/4 " shy on each end and filled with thickend epoxie. Back to wolfie, I like the tank toward the bow but make sure it has baffels in it! I also moved my console forward 24 " to make more room for a back to back bench I built with a 48"x44"x24" insulated box under it. I pull a 30’ shrimp net and like the box better than a cooler in the way I also have a 1/2 round 30 gal bait tank on the front of the console with a pair TM battery in a hatch forward
funny you should bring this up, I was just reading the USCG regs on fuel tanks and placement and came across this:
“(h) Each fuel tank labeled under Sec. 183.514(b)(8) for installation aft of the boat’s half length must be installed with its center of gravity aft of the boat’s half length.”
If installed fwd of “half length”, tanks have to be tested for higher loading. I didn’t know that until today. Probably one of many reasons most manufacturers put tanks towards the rear half of the boat. Driving factor being that they are not subjected to slamming the way they would be near the bow. Makes sense.
After going over it again I’m planning to center the tank at 102" from the transom. I want the CG of the boat to fall at 7.5-8 ft forward of transom (as best I can tell that’s where it was originally). I’ve done some pretty extensive calculations with the best info I have and think that I can maintain that even with the motor on bracket.
funny you should bring this up, I was just reading the USCG regs on fuel tanks and placement and came across this:
“(h) Each fuel tank labeled under Sec. 183.514(b)(8) for installation aft of the boat’s half length must be installed with its center of gravity aft of the boat’s half length.”
If installed fwd of “half length”, tanks have to be tested for higher loading. I didn’t know that until today. Probably one of many reasons most manufacturers put tanks towards the rear half of the boat. Driving factor being that they are not subjected to slamming the way they would be near the bow. Makes sense.
After going over it again I’m planning to center the tank at 102" from the transom. I want the CG of the boat to fall at 7.5-8 ft forward of transom (as best I can tell that’s where it was originally). I’ve done some pretty extensive calculations with the best info I have and think that I can maintain that even with the motor on bracket.
Same boat hull…different topsides and motor.(WEIGHT)
With an outboard out 3 feet off the stern(bracket addition) everything changes.
Whip roll is increased with less hull in the water.
As far as aft placement of fuel aft… better have great tabs…
Keep up the nice work.
thats a great rebuild link. Love the old Bertrams.
I would prefer to be able to test the balance before tank goes in but I don’t have a motor or bracket yet, and don’t want to hold everything else up till I do. Going to have to hope my moment calculations are close enough [:0]
really though, I think I’ve got a pretty good handle on it. I weighed literally every piece I took out and recorded it’s location, and have tracked everything I’ve put back in. With some educated guesses (well educated may be too strong, lets just say guesses) on weight/placement of other items I can come up with a pretty good idea where tank needs to be to keep CG where it should be. As far as overall weight, I was initially worried about it being too light after tearing out all the heavy wood/glass Mako used, but with all the extra stringer structure, bracket, motor, livewell, t-top, etc etc it’s not going to be much lighter. But will be much stronger.
think I’m a couple updated behind over here, so cut and paste:
haven’t updated in a while(you know the drill, work family etc) but have been chipping away at getting stringer grid completed.
Got core templated and cut for transverse bulkheads, two large ones to wall off the tank “coffin”, and three outside the stringers on each side. Used 1" thick 15 lb coosa for the forward and aft bulkheads, and 2x3/4" for the center and tank bulkheads. I am pretty sure the boat would be structurally sound with the bulkheads, but only adds about 20 lbs to the overall structure and will definitely add a lot of support. Also will provide more support for the deck, so can get away with smaller span = less glass/core = less weight (and less $$) there.
After glassing the stringers I wasn’t looking forward to doing that type of work again anytime soon, so I took a different approach with the bulkheads. Glassed them out of the boat, then will bed and tab in the finished pieces.
just for grins I tried to vacuum bag one pair of bulkheads. Was not too successful with the bagging, parts came out very solid but the peel ply and bleeder cloth got too saturated with resin around the edges and I couldn’t get all the peel ply off. Ended up having to grind/sand off a few sections. Still need to work on my technique.
Decided that wasn’t worth the hassle. However, using peel ply over a hand lamination was awesome. Wet the pre-cut glass + peel ply out flat, then wrapped around primed core. Not really needed in this case, but produces a perfectly uniform surface on the finished part, and made it really easy to work out bubbles and keep the glass pulled tight over the radiused tops. Peel ply came off the hand layup evenly with reasonable effort. Had to grind a little excess glass/resin of the edges but the finished bulkheads are only about 3-5 lbs each and solid as a rock!
Outer bulkheads are all glassed, trimmed to fit and bedded on prepped areas of hull. Will touch up the corner fillets and tab in tomorrow, hopef
sheesh I am tired of working on the stringer grid. Finally got all the transverse bulkheads I made tabbed in. Still need to install the two large bulkheads that will form the tank compartment, but at least the end is in sight.
Not sure which was worse, trying to lay up big wet sticky pieces of glass in the boat or cutting and fitting a bazillion pieces of tabbing to attach the bulkheads I layed up outside the boat. Both pretty much sucked.
Got them all squared up then bedded and filleted. this was one of the ones I tried to bag, looks like @ss because i had to give it some love with the sander/grinder to get the peel ply off.
didn’t get a good pic of them all tabbed in before dark but you get the idea. flash makes it look a lot messier than it really is, I promise
Man, you can get it. Goat head and do your layup in the boat…with a big fan and get signed up for a liver transplant. Think about the money your saving and the boat you’ll have when your done.
It sucks climbing in and out of a boat your working on. It takes the place of the yuppies on stair steppers…exercise and getting something done. You’ll find out who your real friends are when you’re fiberglassing. My boy hated mixing resin for me…as well as the grinding…and itching.
That hull will be more than stronger than the day it was built. When you get tired of your real job…you can always lay glass.
quote:Originally posted by mdaddy
When you get tired of your real job...you can always lay glass.
ha no thanks!
Wanted to start running conduit for rigging chases but they don’t stock 3" at my local Lowes or HD so I’ll have to try a legit electrical supply place tomorrow. Wanted to get something going this weekend but oh well, always plenty of work to do.
Bulkheads are all in, so stringer grid is complete. Still a few details to clean up but its good to basically be done with this part of the project.
Also spent a few hours grinding down rough glass edges, added some extra tabbing to the stringer/transom joint, and general cleaning.
