quote: Next question for thread; what to do next???
I don’t know. I know what I feel is the root cause. The only thing I can personally do is what I think is right at every opportunity. Shutting down fertilizer, pesticides and weed killers on Hilton Head golf courses is way beyond my pay grade. Heritage Golf Tournament is coming up, millions of dollars to be made on Hilton Head, fertilizer spreaders are running strong as we speak. I’d bet that just one golf course’s chemicals kills more fish than most fishermen combined.
Capt. Larry Teuton
Cracker Built Custom Boats
“Ships are the nearest things to dreams that hands have ever made.” -Robert N. Rose
quote:But back to my last post, any info on effects of chemicals
or other type run off affecting food chain of these waters that would
cause cobia ,ect, ect, to leave or alter historic reproduction????
50 years of observation is my only solid info. 25 years ago we didn’t have the Colleton River Plantation, or the Rose Hill Plantation, or the Moss Creek Plantation, or the Okatie Plantation, or the Palmetto Bluff Plantation, or the Honey Horn. Didn’t have the Haig Point Plantation or Bloody Point Plantation on Daufuskie Island either, with all their associated golf courses, manicured grounds and housing, all of them on our river banks. All draining into the Broad River, and all of those places before you even cross over the Hilton Head bridge. How much chemicals can our saltwater creeks stand and still support life? Heck, I’m surprised it does as well as it still does,I ain’t no fish scientist, but I’m not an idiot either.
If you have a big saltwater aquarium at home, try mixing 1/4 ounce of yard fertilizer, 1/4 ounce of weed killer, 1/4 ounce of fire ant killer, a 1/4 ounce of mole cricket poison, some termite treatment and 1/4 cup of lime…add to that a little bit of oil, gas, antifreeze and other parking lot run off goo… mix it all together and dump it into your aquarium and see what happens to your fish. Does it really take a fish scientist to figure this out?
It’s not fishermen that are hurting the fish population, but it’s only the fishermen who care about preserving it. It ain’t the Bo’s and the Bubba’s keeping too many fish that is causing the issue. We can help it some, no doubt, but we or Waddell can’t fix it much. How do you fix too
quote:Larry, with all due respect, you are wildly off base here. Water quality as affected by man-made pollutants is one of the most closely monitored things there is. The feds and the states are all over this. Run-off from golf courses and other developments is an issue that's been around for a long time,
Warbler, with all due respect to you, you are either very young or you haven’t been around here very long. And you admit you don’t fish in Broad River. Yes, I have been a commercial fisherman, shrimper, crabber, charter boat captain and fishing guide in the area for a long time. I know their methods better than someone who has obviously never done it.
When I started cobia fishing the Broad River with my Dad in the 1950s there was not even one development on Hilton Head. None. They were still building the bridge.
In the 1970’s the entire 278 corridor from 170 to the bridge was all paper company land. Union Camp at the time. I leased 3,000 acres in the Pope Hunting club. It’s now Rose Hill Plantation. Development along there didn’t start until the 1980s. Now it is wall to wall plantations and parking lots from Hardeeville to the tip of the HHI.
And the catch has steadily declined ever since. Where did the catfish go? Did us Bubbas over fish them too, ya think?
Just one old man’s opinion, who’s spent over 50 years fishing that river. I might be off base, it’s possible and I’m not a scientist, just a fisherman who’s seen a lot of change.
quote:Water quality as affected by man-made pollutants is one of the most closely monitored things there is. The feds and the states are all over this
A friend of mine who used to be a commercial shrimper told me that the Waddell center had a shrimp pond breach and the shrimp got out into the wild. This was a long time ago and after the breach the “black lung” appeared. The shrimp in the pond were non native shrimp, and everyone has seen the tiger shrimp that appear here now on occasion. The same friend say that all of his commercial buddies think that black lung was caused by this breach. The black lung started in our area and now is spreading north and south. I don’t know if this has any truth to it, but it definitely makes you think.
My vote is for 1 cobia per boat in state waters, 2 per person federal.
I’m trying to think of one person who would have less credibility on fisheries management issues than a commercial shrimper…
If you mention extortion again, I’ll have your legs broken…
Im not a commercial shrimper, but I do go to help an older gentleman when his normal help can’t go. I learned more about “black lung” in shrimp this past year than I ever did. The Man I go with also believes it came from the Waddell pond breach. But that is only a guess. For you to say that a commercial shrimper has no credibility really shows your lack of knowledge on this. Heavy shrimp populations can hurt fishing, while thin shrimp populations can help it … short term.
I don’t have scientific evidence, but I too agree with Larry’s take on the human population growth and the crap that is in the runoff. Maybe this is what is causing "black
CrackerL; I don’t think warbler been around long enough to remember
how it used to be before the developers raped the coastal areas.
I also know some commercial fishermen and consider them the most
knowledgeable of the fishery with the most to lose, not a bunch of
recreational guys playing sidewalk supervisors or week end warriors. Those that fish the seas (knows the sea)
Fishing the nc coast ,mostly morehead and south to southport, you could fish anywhere , only 2-3 piers so you had to surf fish, and
caught fish every time with few exceptions. Now you can use the roof tops as platforms and walk from Sneeds F. to southport, but no fish worth talking about. My dad always thought it was the septic tanks
leaching into the water, said even fish don’t like the smell of sh#t.
As far as trusting Gov to protect our waters from contaminates
is like watching the keystone cops !!! Just look at the last
few years and think of the intelligence displayed by Gov. We won’t
even go that route.
Worked with a friend in early 70’s who introduced me to the Cobia
in the B-river . His family was from the Lemon I area with nothing else around, all timber and isolated homes.
Some talk great knowledge but exibit little.
quote:As far as trusting Gov to protect our waters from contaminates
is like watching the keystone cops
The same government scientists who thought it was a good idea to spray DDT all over our marshes to kill mosquitoes, and almost made brown pelicans and osprey extinct?
Capt. Larry Teuton
Cracker Built Custom Boats
“Ships are the nearest things to dreams that hands have ever made.” -Robert N. Rose
quote: And, as for commercial shrimpers lacking credibility, two issues: 1) by catch and 2) destruction of live bottom. Yeah, they're real peaches when it comes to fisheries/habitat management.
Again you show your complete lack of knowledge. Shrimp like mud and sand bottom, not live bottom. Even us bubbas know that. Dragging live bottom would rip a $5,000 net to sheds with one drag. Us bubbas who have done that, know that too:wink: And by-catch is something they try hard to avoid, lot of work clearing that out of the nets. Shrimpers invented TEDs BTW.
And have you ever bought shrimp or fish from a market or restaurant? If so you are guilty of your claimed destruction by proxy.
Shrimpers seldom get out of sight of land, usually stay as close to the beach fronts as allowed by law, and last I looked there ain’t much live bottom 3 miles off our coast.
Nobody knows the condition of the fishery better than those who fish it every day for a living. And nobody has more to lose than they do.
Something else my daddy taught me. It’s better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than speak and remove all doubt. He also taught me not to argue with them, so my conversation with you is done.
Capt. Larry Teuton
Cracker Built Custom Boats
“Ships are the nearest things to dreams that hands have ever made.” -Robert N. Rose
quote: And, as for commercial shrimpers lacking credibility, two issues: 1) by catch and 2) destruction of live bottom. Yeah, they're real peaches when it comes to fisheries/habitat management.
Again you show your complete lack of knowledge. Shrimp like mud and sand bottom, not live bottom. Even us bubbas know that. Dragging live bottom would rip a $5,000 net to sheds with one drag. Us bubbas know that too:wink: And by-catch is something they try hard to avoid, lot of work clearing that out of the nets. Shrimpers invented TEDs BTW.
Shrimpers seldom get out of sight of land, usually stay as close to the beach fronts as allowed by law, and last I looked there ain’t much live bottom 3 miles off our coast.
Nobody knows the condition of the fishery better than those who fish it every day for a living. And nobody has more to lose than they do.
Something else my daddy taught me. It’s better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than speak and remove all doubt. He also taught me not to argue with them, so my conversation with you is done.
Capt. Larry Teuton
Cracker Built Custom Boats
“Ships are the nearest things to dreams that hands have ever made.” -Robert N. Rose
Who’s calling people names now, Larry?
Your commercial background gives you a stilted view. TEDs invented by shrimpers? Sure, to reduce their catch of cannonball jellyfish! They didn’t give two squirts about the turtles and they still don’t give two squirts about the enormous bycatch they kill every year. TEDs don’t prevent juvenile trout, flounder and other gamefish from getting ki
Larry knows more about fishing and navigating our coast than most of us rec guys will ever learn in our lifetime. When he speaks around here people listen. My father also told me not to argue with a fool. So it’s my turn to call names… Warbler we are a tight knit bunch around here. We respect each other and each other’s opinions. We help people that need help when we can and how we can. We haven’t had any BS on this forum until you showed up spewing your nonsense all over us. I for one would appreciate it if you would be more respectful to people even if you disagree with them. Like I said before this thread is being used as a tool to gain information on the South Carolina cobia. If you would like to discuss your feelings on comercial fisherman then start a new thread and do it there.
Larry knows more about fishing and navigating our coast than most of us rec guys will ever learn in our lifetime. When he speaks around here people listen. My father also told me not to argue with a fool. So it’s my turn to call names… Warbler we are a tight knit bunch around here. We respect each other and each other’s opinions. We help people that need help when we can and how we can. We haven’t had any BS on this forum until you showed up spewing your nonsense all over us. I for one would appreciate it if you would be more respectful to people even if you disagree with them. Like I said before this thread is being used as a tool to gain information on the South Carolina cobia. If you would like to discuss your feelings on comercial fisherman then start a new thread and do it there.
07 Scout Winyah Bay 221 Yamaha F150
I don’t care how tight you are with your internet buddies (who you’ve likely never met in person). I reject your premise that Larry knows that much more than some of us. A lot of y’all internet fishermen won’t understand that.
This thread is being used to push agendas, plain and simple. One of the foremost experts on the SC cobia fishery (Karl B) has offered his take on this issue, and his implied advice has been ignored. Y’all can spin this however you want, but the fact remains, sometimes it’s necessary to shut a fishery down…this may be one of those times.
If you’re capable, tell me what I’ve said that’s “BS” or “nonsense.” Good luck.
If you mention extortion again, I’ll have your legs broken…
Your BS and nonsense in that post is that I haven’t met them. I have met more than a few of them. I have been to Larry’s home. I have fished with them. Worked on their boats. Drove 40 miles to wash a boat for a member of this forum because he had to have it at a dealership for sale that Monday and wasn’t able to make it down here to do it himself. Changed brakes on trailers. All of this because they are my friends and we treat each other with respect. We are not just internet fisherman that I can assure you of. As for your BS on what Larry does and doesn’t know compared to yourself… Well let’s just say that a man with a character like Larry’s doesn’t need to be defended. As for you well… That speaks for itself as well.
Your BS and nonsense in that post is that I haven’t met them. I have met more than a few of them. I have been to Larry’s home. I have fished with them. Worked on their boats. Drove 40 miles to wash a boat for a member of this forum because he had to have it at a dealership for sale that Monday and wasn’t able to make it down here to do it himself. Changed brakes on trailers. All of this because they are my friends and we treat each other with respect. We are not just internet fisherman that I can assure you of. As for your BS on what Larry does and doesn’t know compared to yourself… Well let’s just say that a man with a character like Larry’s doesn’t need to be defended. As for you well… That speaks for itself as well.
07 Scout Winyah Bay 221 Yamaha F150
I didn’t think you could answer the question. Your (and others) arguing tactic is despicable…attack the messenger, not the message. I’m glad you are buds with Larry…too bad neither of you can discuss things on the substantive level without picking up your ball and going home and calling others “fools” for disagreeing with you. You’re attacking my character? Really? You don’t know the first thing about me.
If you mention extortion again, I’ll have your legs broken…
Rite on CrackerL with the DDT, along with the phosphates and other
chems dumped into the waterways. I understand also there are lesions
on some of the bottom fish that is suspected to be caused by mercury
and or arsenic poisoning. These type of issues are a longer term
problem that needs to be corrected instead of a short term or worse,
a total shut down of the industry IMO!!!
quote:
I don't care how tight you are with your internet buddies (who you've likely never met in person).
Wrong again This Internet buddy has been to my house a few times, he’s been to my shop, he knows me and I know him and we both know the fish. you obviously dont. And you are wrong again Warbler. Pick up your marbles and go home. 3 strikes and you’re out. Leave this to people who know what they are talking about. The subject is too serious for fools who have never caught a cobia in Broad River to be involved in and just run their mouth and think they know what they are talking about.
Capt. Larry Teuton
Cracker Built Custom Boats
“Ships are the nearest things to dreams that hands have ever made.” -Robert N. Rose
Me. I’ve tried being nice and polite to you and explaining the situation. You don’t get it. If you insist on continuing this discussion, I might call you a foolish idiot that doesn’t have a clue what he is talking about, but I hate to do that on an public forum. So if you want to take this up in person my email is LTeuton at aol dot com, my phone number is 912, six five 5 five six seven 4. My address is 1448 Clyo Shawnee Rd, Clyo, GA 31303.
I welcome you to come by and visit, and run that mouth in person.
Capt. Larry Teuton
Cracker Built Custom Boats
“Ships are the nearest things to dreams that hands have ever made.” -Robert N. Rose
quote:
I don't care how tight you are with your internet buddies (who you've likely never met in person).
Wrong again This Internet buddy has been to my house a few times, he’s been to my shop, he knows me and I know him and we both know the fish. you obviously dont. And you are wrong again Warbler. Pick up your marbles and go home. 3 strikes and you’re out. Leave this to people who know what they are talking about. The subject is too serious for fools who have never caught a cobia in Broad River to be involved in and just run their mouth and think they know what they are talking about.
Capt. Larry Teuton
Cracker Built Custom Boats
“Ships are the nearest things to dreams that hands have ever made.” -Robert N. Rose
I’m not going anywhere. I’ll continue to talk about substantive issues and voice my opinion. If you want to leave the arena, so be it. I’ll take my unrefuted points as concessions on your part. Good day, sir.
If you mention extortion again, I’ll have your legs broken…
Me. I’ve tried being nice and polite to you and explaining the situation. You don’t get it. If you insist on continuing this discussion, I might call you a foolish idiot that doesn’t have a clue what he is talking about, but I hate to do that on an public forum. So if you want to take this up in person my email is LTeuton at aol dot com, my phone number is 912, six five 5 five six seven 4. My address is 1448 Clyo Shawnee Rd, Clyo, GA 31303.
I welcome you to come by and visit, and run that mouth in person.
Capt. Larry Teuton
Cracker Built Custom Boats
“Ships are the nearest things to dreams that hands have ever made.” -Robert N. Rose
Whoa, whoa, whoa. Taking it to the next level, eh, Larry? Didn’t figure you for an internet toughguy but guess I was wrong. Do you call everyone who disagrees with you a “foolish idiot”? That’s not a very strong method of debate/discussion.
If you mention extortion again, I’ll have your legs broken…
quote:
If you mention extortion again, I'll have your legs broken.....
You’ve got my name, phone number, email and street address. I don’t hide anything from anybody and I’m not an internet tough guy…I’m real. How about you? What is your name? Want to come see me and talk about breaking some legs in person? Come on, door is always open. You’ve got the address.
Capt. Larry Teuton
Cracker Built Custom Boats
“Ships are the nearest things to dreams that hands have ever made.” -Robert N. Rose
quote:
If you mention extortion again, I'll have your legs broken.....
You’ve got my name, phone number, email and street address. I don’t hide anything from anybody and I’m not an internet tough guy…I’m real. How about you? What is your name? Want to come see me and talk about breaking some legs in person? Come on, door is always open. You’ve got the address.
Capt. Larry Teuton
Cracker Built Custom Boats
“Ships are the nearest things to dreams that hands have ever made.” -Robert N. Rose
You do realize what you quoted is my signature, right? I’m not very original or funny so I borrowed that from a famous movie…maybe you’ve heard of it: Animal House? Here’s a clip:
You’re coming dangerously close to communicating a threat, which I’d seriously advise you not to do. Maybe you’re drinking and that liquid courage has you all amped up, but you need to crank it down a notch…I’ve done nothing but discuss issues. I disagreed with you and you’ve become unhinged for some reason.
If you mention extortion again, I’ll have your legs broken…
